Lets start the discussion. We would like to hear your suggestions with regards to the changes in the current rules for SoloDex events. Also what improvement and\or modifications would you like to see made to the events.

We would also be scheduling a meeting before the first competition event with all members to discuss these points.

Re: The returning champion.

Should he/she be required to participate for a minimum number of events or qualify in any particular way in the following year of competition, before being allowed to defend the title at the championship? I think currently, he/she does not need to be an active competitor in order to defend the title.

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can I run John Cooper Works suspension on the MINI and stay in ES?

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what about r tires without bumping

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classification by performance, instead of the current method (classification by theory)

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too impractical imo
who will be the test driver?
you gonna class cars differently for fast courses vs slow courses?

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MG man, I'm starting to think there is no such difference. All the courses have tight turns.

dunno about the fancy cars, but certain courses defintely suit my cars better than others
there arfe courses with tight turns but also long stretches, compared to courses with shorter stretches puctuated with turns and slaloms etc.....

In any event, where are we going to find a driver who will be able to max out a FWD, RWD and AWD car equally, in order to demonstrate the best that each car can do..........not to mention not everyone can effectively drive a car without ABS, or even a car without servo-assisted brakes...and before you startt on about mih ole cars, lots of competition cars do not have these.....so again, who is the best suited driver to demonstrate the best performance of such a wide range of cars?
And assuming say a field of 40 or so cars, how much time would we need to have each car trsted on track? (factoring peoples schedules, familiarization time etc)
What would such a track layout be? (I'm thinking a figure eight)

While wagonrunner continues to proclaim the current system flawed, how many people over say the past 3 years have had genuine issues over the classification of their car?

The only bone of contention with the current rules imo is Devi running SSS suspension on a Swift and it being considered allowable under the current rules..........in principle I should be able to retrofit a lancer with evo suspension and run the same class as a stock lancer...........which relates back to my question about the MINI running on JCW suspension and staying in ES...........it makes no sense......based on current rules, if I buy the equivalent suspension upgrades as a JCW cooper using aftermarket parts, I would be in SS at least....yet I can pick up original JCW suspension components and not get a class bump....does that make sense?

To put it another way, if Pete upgrades his swift's suspension with equivalent aftermarket suspension to an SSS, he will be bumped..........how can that make sense? SSS suspension is not a factory option on a Stock swift, yet it is allowed under that argument..........

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I see your point EmmGee.

the history of R-compound tyres re Bumping

In the beginning, there was a safety concern about novices using R-compound tyres (risk of roll over, yes it is possible) so to get around it somewhat, Rs constitited a bump

When there was a sudden influx of 13" R compounds on the market, the rule was magically changed, and Rs were a free spec, with no class bump.........the argument was raised that not everyone would want to run a second set of tyres...........the counter-argument was 'hoss dey cheap, anybody could afford dem'
So magically, if you had the $600 for a set, and some 13" rims, and assuming you could FIT 13s on your car, voila, instant 2 sec advantage

As supplies of R compound tyres dried up, suddenly Rs are now a class bump again

go figure...........

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on every single course right.?
that's one of theories i don't comprehend.
others are:
suspension upgrades give the same "performance increase / advantage" regardless of vehicle fitted too, so penalty points are the same.
after dynoing, all cars gearboxes run at the same efficiency, so calcuted power at the flywheel.

Are those three things theories or facts?
Cause if anyone could honestly and adamantly tell me "They are facts. 100% true. 100% of the time". I'd accept it.
But if you keep adjusting a system based on flaws, guess what's going to be the outcome of the system.

I believe the benefit of any upgrade could only be seen at one point.



PS. forgot one. cars with similar ratio (weight to power) handle / grip the same.

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I agree with you 100%
And no matter what system we use, there will be flaws, and conditions that favour one system over another
Regarding the power-lap system, some of your arguments against the current rules still apply. Your argument re the 2-sec 'myth' for example.........different courses favour different gearing, suspension setups etc...........so what would you suggest for a power-lap course? Can you guarantee 100% that the comparative classes set at the power lap will apply regardless of course design?
Can you guarantee that stig will be 100% consistent 100% of the time to accurately post the best times for each car?

And as mentioned before, what is the guarantee that our 'stig' will be able to maximize preformance of every car that competes at dex?

Show me a practical framework for a power lap classification system and I will support you 100%
(And I will then say no fculking way anybody drivin my car so class me wherever you want and I will accept it, because I not willing to risk someone mis-shifting my unconventional shift pattern and blowing my engine)

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to your guarantees........ no i can't.
and far for your saying "class me wherever", that's the point isn't it.
It's a chance to find out / prove, what the car really do, vs being told what it can potentially do.

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a couple suggestions....make it 5 out of 6 championship events that count towards max overall pts...and you dont have to do 5 events to qualify for the championship...lets reduce that to 3.

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I find the 4 out of 6 is fine. The minimum could be reduced but IMHO shouldn't increase the number that count.

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yup 4 of 6 works well, and helps guys who have to fly out, have breakdowns etc

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^^or work as happened to me in 2011

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correct
the 4/6 system has been working...no sense changing it

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yes the 4/6 sytem works but i'd like to see us up it a notch and become more competitive...i think we are to laid back in solodex...no other form of racing allows you to drop 33% of comp....at SCCA events you dont get to drop any...the karting club has somthing like 10 events and they get to drop one...its a a small change i am suggesting eventualy i'd like to see at least 8 events where you get to drop none!..

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again, look at how many of your members have work and travel commitments that will be impacted by this
Are we trying to compete with other clubs, or find a formula that keeps members coming back year after year
I mos def will not be able to handle 8 events a year with all my other committments
Remember the roots of dex Devi.......not hardcore 'racing' but a fun event that attracts the average Joe

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this becomes less and less applicable every year.

^ exactly rjaggs...i too remember the roots of dex kevin...but we are evolving and now we're faced with competition from Drag and wind

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5 events for the championship will be a deal-breaker for me..........
we'll see how it goes
re: rjaggs comment, keep in mind novices continue to feed dex every year
most do not try it because they want herd core racing
don't confuse the core of hard core competitors with the overall mix of drivers
That sort of mentality is what creates the cyclical ebb and flow of new competitors over time
take the time to speak to novices and you'll see what I mean

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Hi, novice here, and i want to get involved in solodex this year, because i want to be a better driver, but i'd hate to think that its because of persons like myself that the sport is being held back. Isn't there some way the two major parties (novices and hard core racers) can get what they are looking for? Perhaps make dex a bit more hard core and have a have more driving school events?

cause as far as i can tell, if you don't encourage new membership the club will eventually die, and if you don't keep the existing member at least kinda happy, they will leave and the club will eventually die

I think its time to introduce a PRO series. That way we could have the best of both worlds from the same member base. PRO series with best 5 out of 6 with a min of 4 events to qualify and the Dex race series with best 3 out of 6 with a min of 2 to qualify.

Actually, in SCCA solo, it's a 7/10 thing to qualify for the year end points. Don't know about the other forms of SCCA racing though.

and Whizpig ..... novices are the one factor that allows the sport to grow. we all started out as novices and without the influx of novices into the sport the regulars will get fat and complacent without the "hot new driver' coming through the ranks.

Kirk

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why you guys trying to reinvent the wheel re the championship?
Has anyone complained that 4 out of 6 is not enough?
Has anyone complained that because of how the current championship is structured, they rather go to drag and wind(ing)?

Vishnu, what would be the point of two series?
the NE class already deals with that, no?

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Gotta agree with kevin on this one....don't think the championship needs tweaking right now.

I think some more exciting courses....faster courses...would really do us well.

I hear you, but based strictly on (my) observation, the few novices who develop into more dedicated/mainstream competitors have either started with reasonably competitive cars or quickly realise that in order to keep up (with the hardcore competitors) they have to dish out $$ for mods, etc.

Wrt increasing the number of qualifying events....It will definitely rule me out of qualifying.

RJ, either way, how many members have you heard say 'gee, I wish we had 5 events rather than 4 count towards the championship'

the underlying issue stemming from your point is related to the rules and how they reward upgrades.
IMO the most critical issue relating to the retention of fresh competitors is the cost factor. GS used to be the only class that reflected an 'anyone can win' attraction, back when it was me in the mg, alan in the lancer, sanjay in the B11 and Curtis in the B11.........and each of us one a championship
Sadly all of our cars 'cept Curtis' are all down......

HS was also another large class, which again has dwindled, and I don't think it is necessarily due to people being discouraged by cost

The Club needs to continue focusing on what attracts novices, not how to cater to the existing membership base

A few years back when novices accounted for over half a field of competitors, we ended up whith guys like Chris, Anthony, David, yourself, Blue Primera guy who won the Spirit of Comp Award, among others....I don't think that list is full of guys who spent serious $$$ on their cars to gain / maintain an edge........

If you look at the year when we started getting a huge influx of new competitors, it was the year the CARS forum was moved to tuner.............this simple fact has always been overlooked........and continues to be overlooked while we seem to be arguing over non-issues

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