Driving School 2 Change of date

[mazdamaniac]

Hi Folks,
The second SoloDex driving school is presently carded for 08th April 2012 which is Easter Sunday and being a long weekend quite a few members may prefer to spend this time with their family. As a result we are proposing a change of date to 22 April 2012. This will also shorten the time between the driving school and SoloDex 2 in which the same course will be used for both events to heighten the competition. This new date has already been cleared with TTRC. Please let us know if there are any objections to this new date or if this will be a welcomed change.

Vishnu Charran
Head of SoloDex

[chris1388]

I honestly don't like the trend that is developing here in solodex with using a BYCC course as the competition course. Solodex was based on the idea that each competition event would be a new and unique course, this was one of the things that actually gave dex some excitement....now you guys are taking this away??

I disagree with the justification being to encourage novice drivers. It is no secret that dex is being dominated by the recent drag and wind events and our crowd is on the decline....this certainly is not a decision that will push the sport to grow....its a backward step IMO.

Has it come to the point where our execs no longer have the ingenuity to create and design a new and exciting course?

[MG Man]

Has it come to the point where our execs no longer have the ingenuity to create and design a new and exciting course?

anybody send out an email to members?
not everyone relies on this forum for updates

[wagonrunner]

I honestly don't like the trend that is developing here in solodex with using a BYCC course as the competition course. Solodex was based on the idea that each competition event would be a new and unique course, this was one of the things that actually gave dex some excitement....now you guys are taking this away??

Has it come to the point where our execs no longer have the ingenuity to create and design a new and exciting course?

Those different courses are submitted by members, racers (past/present/future), persons who willing to give the time to try something for others. In other words not just the exec.

I notice you beyotch about courses. when they published "me eh like dat" " dat boring" "bleh". Yet I've never seen you submit one. Have you?

[Mr. Fixables]

I would be very happy to plot out a course for an event. All I need is the blank format so that I can plan it correctly.

Kirk

[wagonrunner]

To be honest. no true format to it anymore. it's not like in the days wehre courses had to go around rumble strips.
JPG's and visio diagrams are both used to show the idea, and it's attempted to be laid out as closely as possible with the usual safety concerns. Which are the container on the southern side, and the fencing.

If you got viso, send me your email for the same stencil as from last years dex 6 course available at Solodex 6 - The Finale! - Sunday November 13


Can also go through past stencils and get the courses there, erase, and that's your stencil.

[wagonrunner]

This new date has already been cleared with TTRC.

THAT is my only real concern with the date change. really hoping you meant to type TTKA

[pete]

blue rectangle is the container. Rough location.

[chris1388]

I honestly don't like the trend that is developing here in solodex with using a BYCC course as the competition course. Solodex was based on the idea that each competition event would be a new and unique course, this was one of the things that actually gave dex some excitement....now you guys are taking this away??

Has it come to the point where our execs no longer have the ingenuity to create and design a new and exciting course?

Those different courses are submitted by members, racers (past/present/future), persons who willing to give the time to try something for others. In other words not just the exec.

I notice you beyotch about courses. when they published "me eh like dat" " dat boring" "bleh". Yet I've never seen you submit one. Have you?

In my brief history of solodex NEVER have i heard the exec invite course design from members for an official competition event, the head of solodex has always posted the course....since I've been around anyway. If this is the case then the exec should invite course design applications for each event of the year.

The way I see it your comment does not even seem to be a fair idea, since a member who is also a competitor on the day can be biased and design a course to suit his/her car.

Vishnu please clarify exactly why you have decided to go down this path. I highly doubt it is because no one else wants to create a "new" course as wagonrunner is implying. If it is then please officially clarify if indeed a member who is also competing in the championship can submit a course for an official competition event.

[wagonrunner]

I'd answer you and say anyone can submit a course to the head of dex, who then has to get it approved by the exec, and that course could then be used.

But I'm pretty sure you'd prefer to hear that from the current Head of Dex, Vishnu.
So I'll let you wait.

The way I see it your comment does not even seem to be a fair idea, since a member who is also a competitor on the day can be biased and design a course to suit his/her car.

one........... wow............ at the thinking, and two didn't the persons you think responsible for all courses during your short experience, also compete?

[chris1388]

Last year it was reyos I believe that did the course design and he did not compete in the championship.

[wagonrunner]

And the year before?, and the year before? and even the year before that?
I'm unable again to tell you, so until you hear it from whom you'd choose to listen to.

[mazdamaniac]

It is apparent that clarification is needed. Firstly there is no issue wrt ingenuity being absent when it comes to course design and I take great offence to that remark. It looks like instead of a "whirl pool" course some people want to get a tornado course instead. With that out of the way the intention for Driving School 2 was not to have the same course as Driving School 1 as it seemed to have been interpreted. There will be a new SoloDex course for this training day which will serve to familiarize the rookies with a true SoloDex competition course that cris crosses the white painted lines that they have used so far. To afford a better grasp this new course will be used a second time for actual competition. As Head of SoloDex it is my responsibility to cater for the rookies as well as the experienced drivers and to gather feedback to improve the SoloDex experience. Admittedly some of the experienced drivers may shy away or rebel against the added difficulty of using a previously known course for competition albeit only 4 out of the total 7 competition events.
It is also true that any interested person can do a course design and submit it to the Head of SoloDex for consideration. I designed the whirl pool course last year and submitted it to Reyos and I competed on it. Any experienced SoloDexer can confirm that a course designed on paper and mentally driven is vastly different when laid out on a car park and actually driven.

So please submit your course design proposals and don't be afraid of a little more competition than you are used too.

[xauss]

tried sumting:

[NLVA200]

The way I see it your comment does not even seem to be a fair idea, since a member who is also a competitor on the day can be biased and design a course to suit his/her car.

It is also true that any interested person can do a course design and submit it to the Head of SoloDex for consideration. I designed the whirl pool course last year and submitted it to Reyos and I competed on it. Any experienced SoloDexer can confirm that a course designed on paper and mentally driven is vastly different when laid out on a car park and actually driven.

If I recall correctly, even though Vishnu submitted and ran a course of his own design to Reyos for Solodex 2, 2011, he did not have much of an advantage on the day. The results have shown it.

[xauss]

GAWD!!!! DAT *^%&% COURSE!!!! LOL

[NLVA200]

^^ nice try!! i like it.

btw, nice sig

[chris1388]

Why was this proposal not run by the members before being implemented? What happens if an experienced driver can't make the driving school while his fellow competitors practice the dex 2 course all day?
Tough luck to that man?
Part of the sport has always been to interpret and navigate a new course on competition day, this has always set us apart from other forms of the sport.
There were a handfull of novices last driving school if so many, so are you altering the solodex concept for 5 to 6 people?

[mazdamaniac]

Why was this proposal not run by the members before being implemented? What happens if an experienced driver can't make the driving school while his fellow competitors practice the dex 2 course all day?
Tough luck to that man?
Part of the sport has always been to interpret and navigate a new course on competition day, this has always set us apart from other forms of the sport.
There were a handfull of novices last driving school if so many, so are you altering the solodex concept for 5 to 6 people?

Please note that without these 5 to 6 people (rookies) you will have no new competition to make you grow.
There will always be persons who would miss an event for one reason or the other. The onus is on the competitor to attend the events. That is life and we all have dealt with it and will continue to deal with it.

[MG Man]

sorry eh but I have to agree with chris on this one
the BYCC will basically become free practice before the actual dex event, giving a clear advantage to those who can attend the BYCC.........why must it be the same course? Isn't the driving school all about learning to handle different corners, understanding the cone convention etc?
If you guys think it will increase the competition, why not just run the same exact course every event?

[pete]

Well, from my own experience at the BYCC and Solodex 1, even though the course was the same the track was very different. Definitely had less grip for the competition event and that was even before it started to rain.

[mazdamaniac]

sorry eh but I have to agree with chris on this one
the BYCC will basically become free practice before the actual dex event, giving a clear advantage to those who can attend the BYCC.........why must it be the same course? Isn't the driving school all about learning to handle different corners, understanding the cone convention etc?
If you guys think it will increase the competition, why not just run the same exact course every event?

Why should the driving school just be about handle different corners, understanding the cone convention etc. As we all know there is alot more to it than just that. We have tried using the karting course for all the BYCC events last year with limited success. We are trying different things and all we are asking is that you give it a chance and lets see how it shakes out.

[chris1388]

My point is this a decision that goes against the entire solodex concept in that a new course is used every competition event. Yet the exec felT the need to simplu overide the members and go ahead and make this change.
Why were we not aked, alerted or made to vote on such a matter. All I hav seen thus far in this thread is the comittee members peten anthony vishnu backinh this up.
And the justification for this is the novices? Whom are few in numbers

[wagonrunner]

My point is this a decision that goes against the entire solodex concept in that a new course is used every competition event. Yet the exec felT the need to simplu overide the members and go ahead and make this change.
Why were we not aked, alerted or made to vote on such a matter. All I hav seen thus far in this thread is the comittee members peten anthony vishnu backinh this up.
And the justification for this is the novices? Whom are few in numbers

then you have no point. and are once again making assumptions and statements.
Else in the history of solodex, no course would ever have been repeated. not so?
Well, that's not the case. they have been. So................

Solodex offers changing courses. They are sometimes repeated with one rule. A championship course will be not be used twice in the same year for championship points. so you now get 7 different courses for the 7 championship events.
They are repeated for different reasons (drivers liked it, etc). Rookies don't have favorite courses yet. So the one they "practice" on, they feel a bit more comfortable at an "event".

And before we are once again blessed with "In your experience", please allow your mind to grasp the concept there are others whose experience is greater than yours.

It's not about your interpretation, which in my opinion is severely skewed and baseless.
It's about what is.

[pete]

Thing is that even though the same basic course might be used for the BYCC and then the competition event, cones would never be in the same place so you really can't plan a strategy for attacking the course in competition based on the BYCC.

What having the courses similar will do is help rookies get accustomed to the cone convention and flow of the course so that they will not get intimidated by the thought that they may get lost in competition.

More seasoned competitors should use the BYCC to get a better feel for their car but should not have any advantage by doing the BYCC in planning braking points etc because all that may change on a competition day, corners may be slightly tighter, gates may be wider to allow a faster exit etc, all that needs to be checked when walking the course.

Anyway, I don't think there is going to be a BYCC before every competition event so this will not be repeated all year long. It's one way to encourage rookies to come out at the start to get accustomed so they can be prepared for the competition later on in the year.

[MG Man]

Wagonrunner, repeated is one thing, but not back-to-back in such quick succession

[wagonrunner]

Wagonrunner, repeated is one thing, but not back-to-back in such quick succession

Its being done that way for a reason.

There were a handfull of novices last driving school if so many, so are you altering the solodex concept for 5 to 6 people?

Please note that without these 5 to 6 people (rookies) you will have no new competition to make you grow.
There will always be persons who would miss an event for one reason or the other. The onus is on the competitor to attend the events. That is life and we all have dealt with it and will continue to deal with it.

And if it makes that big a difference, then how come the results differ at an event that's been using the "same" course since inception?
What's wrong with back to back? It's been done before.

what is it you really fear?

[MG Man]

Chris for one, has nothing to fear...just look at his times...........I think he is just voicing a concern, as should any member who wishes to do so.....
does anyone have any stats that show how many members check this forum on a regular basis?
Just wondering how many people will see this discussion...

[wagonrunner]

nothing wrong with voicing a concern, but basically slandering the folks who actually make the effort to keep this thing going, with untrue statements / accusations forces me to view that behavior in a different manner.

as for stats. check the mods and admin.

[chris1388]

I disagree totally with what pete has said, driving a course several times even though it is not the exact same thing on the 2 days DOES give an advantage to say someone who will only run it 4 times for competition. Part of the sport is navigating the course correctly that is why we have cone penalties and DNF's....practicing a similar to near identical course right before the competition event gives those persons a CLEAR advantage.

As for karl, I have nothing to fear. My driving always speaks on the day. Fact of the matter is this gives an unfair advantage to people who drive the BYCC and the executives of the club went ahead and made this decision on THEIR OWN amongst them selves...hence the reason pete etc is backing the idea up. WHY were the members not asked what they think of such an arrangement?

I understand the point is to help the novice drivers, but did any of us regulars have to do that to stick to dex or become better?????? We all learned the concept through trial and error....what are you all saying, that 2012's rookies are incable of doing the same and need to be spoonfed?

The point is to help develop the drivers not coach them through the season. When you go to school does your teacher give you the exam before hand and say practise it and then bring back the same exam for the real thing? Obviously not.

I say propose a simple yet more challenging than the karting course for BYCC and then make a completely different course for dex 2, let the rookies be put to the test and recognise their mistakes. I then have no problem with repeating the dex 2 course for BYCC 3 so that the rookies can be corrected on their mistakes. This is the more sensible approach for the ROOKIES to learn.

What you all are doing is just giving experienced drivers the chance to learn the dex 2 course before hand and is in no way really encouraging development for the rookie drivers.