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Hook
PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2007 10:42 am 
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If your 20V transplant went into a formerly carb’d car, then it’s likely it came without a Check Engine Light, and then you're like me. A CEL is much more important as a warning and diagnostic tool than most mechanics/electricians give it credit. I recently installed one in my AE101 so here's the how-to if u don't have one, and a problem that my CEL immediately uncovered.

Now to make things clearer, there are two silvertop 20V types, pre-May 1993 and post-May 1993, the 2nd of which is much more similar wrt pin designations to the blacktop ECU.On the 20V post-May 1993 S/T ECU, there are 3 plugs, the rightmost of which is the 22pin 'o' plug, this is your concern at this point.
On the pre-May 1993 ECU, the CEL (labelled W) pin is the 5th from the left on the top row, on the post-May 1993 ECU, it's the 7th wire from the left on the top row when looking at the back of the plug as it is connected to the ECU.
The CEL is a negatively-switched output wire, ie. once it's connected to a bulb, the other bulb terminal must be connected to a +ve ignition source. This wire switches from open cct to -ve with the ignition on and back to open cct once the engine has started.

Now, Toyota mass produces their instrument clusters so it's likely you have one already on the dash, just that the bulb and wiring isn't there. Simply get a bulb and socket of the appropriate size and retrofit it into the dash, OR use a 12V LED with the -ve wire connected to the CEL output on the ECU (cuz it's -ve switched). The +ve wire of your CEL must be connected to a +ve ignition source, such as what drives your tach/speedo and can be wired directly into it by using the screw designated IGN+ on either device, and VOILA! You have just installed your CEL.



NOW, on my first test drive I noticed that it lit up upon heavy acceleration and stayed on until I switched off, but lit up again under the same conditions. The ECU was put into diagnostic mode by switching the ignition on with terminals TE1 and E1 connected at the diagnostic port in the engine bay (use a short piece of wire but tin the ends with solder first
to give it strength and prevent frayed strands from touching anything it's not supposed to touch). The CEL flashed four, times, then a short pause and then twice, followed by a long pause and then repeated the same sequence. This told me two things: 1. there was only one error code and 2. that error code was 42, which relates to the vehicle speed sensor.

The vehicle speed sensor needs to be connected to both the speedo (for obvious reasons) AND the ECU as a feedback signal. After 8seconds of driving between 2000rpm to 6000rpm without any VSS signal being detected by the ECU, the CEL switches on to indicate that the ECU is operating in a safe mode and as a result, redline is reduced from 8200rpm to somewhere in the 7000rpm neighbourhood.

The electronic speed sensor on MOST Toyotas have 3 wires, all red in colour with a distinguishing stripe on each.
Red-Blue = +12V (IGN)
Red-Green = earth
Red-Yellow = signal <---There's the wire u want

If you are unsure, switch the ignition on and test the three wires, one will read battery voltage, one will have no potential (earth) and by process of elimination, the other is your signal.

The trick at that point is to simply trace back the wire through the harness (a Multimeter is important here) and connect it to the VSS input, which on the pre-May 1993 ECU is the 9th pin from the left on the top row (labelled SPD) and on the post-May 1993 ECU is the 3rd pin from the left on the top row (labelled SP1).

Once this is done, simply clear the error codes by removing the ECU fuse for about 10-15 seconds. Start the car and let it idle for a couple fan cycles and u good to go.

refer to this thread for links to more 20V info, technical manuals, ECU pinouts and error codes
http://forums.trinituner.com/forums/vie ... p?t=125731


Last edited by Hook on Fri Jun 08, 2007 5:03 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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Hook
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2007 3:54 pm 
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for your further enlightenment...and for those who don't care to d/l d whole service manual

Image

Image

Image

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Slow Poke
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2007 6:07 pm 
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damn good info there man


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Aarong420
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 24, 2007 8:29 pm 
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Interesting indeed,
Im not sure if i have the pre or post 93 20V. A mechanic told me its
OBD II i have. Also it's the type that kicks in VVT under load, not at 4400 rpm as some say. I know this because i have a LED on the VVT. Some say thats silly and makes no sense but it helps in geting to know your car.

The car works alright you know, i think im not hitin full rpm thou, and i did read it can be because of the same speed sonsor. It's there, and wired to the ECU but i dont have the 101 dash so its not runing to the speedo.
The gradual pick up i was talking about, i think it may be sumthing simple like dirdy injectors, but i cant find a way to take them out and clean them, i tried filling the rail with cleaner and flushing it out with fuel pressure. it worked a lil but not 100%. If its sumthing elce I may need to try your method.
I also believe i am burning on the lean side. This can be because i had to move the tps to bring down my idle.
and with the higher lift cam ill need more fuel. Also with the soon to be 2mm bigger ITB's if they bolt up.


Anyway you said : the 2nd of which comes with OBD II and is much more similar wrt pin designations to the blacktop ECU.On the 20V post-May 1993 S/T ECU, there are 3 plugs, the rightmost of which is the 22pin 'o' plug, this is your concern at this point. :

So i take it im finding that wire, hooking it to a LED light and reading the light patterns?

whats, ( +ve & -ve & cct ) ?

I think i gotta buy a book on this :|


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Hook
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 27, 2007 7:15 pm 
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"+ve" = positive

"-ve" = negative

"cct" = circuit

there's nothing wrong with wiring up a "VEEETEK YO!" light on your 20valver...I have one installed too :lol:

if your VVT kicks in independent of rpm then likely it's the post-May1993 ones like mine...just find the pin, connect it to the -ve wire of an LED and connect the LED +ve to a +ve ignition source

I'll post more on code reading 2mro


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Aarong420
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PostPosted: Tue May 22, 2007 3:46 pm 
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Someone told me that my ecu will not save the codes to be read on the diagnostic tester and because of this i cant use it to find problems.
If I where to connect the Engine Check Light would this solve the problem?


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Hook
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PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2007 9:20 am 
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remember, the "W" connector on the ECU is a negative-switched output.so connect one end of your warning light (or negative lead on your LED) to this and connect the other warning light lead to a positive ignition source

I tapped an ignition source from the "IG+" lead on my tach (it's written on the back of the instrument cluster) and ran a thin single core wire back to the ECU "W" connector


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eliteauto
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PostPosted: Wed May 23, 2007 9:28 am 
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good info here


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Aarong420
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PostPosted: Sat May 26, 2007 11:25 am 
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So i went to get this warning light hooked up today, and i realise there is no 22 pin connector, theres a 26 pin connector a 16 pin and a 12 i think.
but in the case of the 26 pin, which wire would it be?
The 7'th wire from the left is a red wire with a black stripe. is this not for the VVT?


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Hook
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PostPosted: Sat May 26, 2007 2:58 pm 
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hmmm...12pin u say?

then THIS may be what u're looking for


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Aarong420
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PostPosted: Sat May 26, 2007 7:39 pm 
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its downloading but doesnt work.


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Hook
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PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2007 12:22 pm 
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nope...works fine...I clicked the link on 3 different computers since and it works fine

just google "4age 20V silvertop pinouts" and u'll get it


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Hook
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 08, 2007 5:00 pm 
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we learn new things every day folks...I recently had a problem with my "O/D Off" light flashing on my dash..here's the remedy


Quote:
A self-diagnosis function is built into the electrical control system. Warning is indicated by the overdrive OFF indicator light.

Note: Warning and diagnostic codes can be read only when the overdrive switch is ON. If OFF, the overdrive OFF light is lit continuously and will not blink.

a. If a malfunction occurs within the speed sensors (No.1 or 2) or solenoids (No.1, 2 or 4), the overdrive OFF light will blink to warn the driver. However, there will be no warning of a malfunction with lock-up solenoid.
b. The diagnostic code can be read by the number of blinks of the overdrive OFF indicator light when terminals TE1 and E1 are connected.
c. The throttle position sensor or brake signal are not indicated, but inspection can be made by checking the voltage at terminal TT of the check connector.
d. The signals to each gear can be checked by measuring the voltage at terminal TT of the check connector while driving.

The diagnostic code (trouble code) is retained in memory by the CPU (of TCCS ECU) and due to back-up voltage, is not canceled out when the engine is turned off. Consequently, after repair, it is necessary to turn the ignition switch off and remove the fuse EFI (15A) or disconnect the TCCS ECU connector to cancel out the diagnostic (trouble) code.

Note: Low battery voltage will cause faulty operation of the diagnosis system. Therefore. always check the battery first. Use a voltmeter and ohmmeter that have an impedance of at least 10K Ohm/Volt.

Check "O/D Off" Indicator Light:

1. Turn the ignition switch ON.
2. The "O/D Off" light will come on when the O/D switch is placed at OFF.
3. When the O/D switch is set to ON, the "O/D Off" light should go out. If the "O/D Off" light flashes when the O/D switch is set to ON, the electronic control system is faulty.

Read Diagnostic Code:

1. Turn ignition switch and o/d switch to ON. Do not start the engine.
Engine NOTE: Warning and diagnostic codes can be read only when the overdrive switch is ON. If OFF, the overdrive OFF light will light continuously and will not blink.

2. Connect TE1, and E1, terminals of check connector.
Read the diagnostic code as indicated by the number of times the O/D OFF light flashes.

Image

Diagnostic Code Indication:

• If the system is operating normally, the light will flash two times per second.

• In the event of a malfunction, the light will flash 1 time per second. The number of blinks will equal the first number and, after 1.5 seconds pause, the second number of the two digit diagnostic code. If there are two or more codes, there will be a 2.5 seconds pause between each.

NOTE: In the event of several trouble codes occurring simultaneously, indication will begin from the smaller value and continue to the larger.

Image



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Aarong420
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 15, 2007 1:46 pm 
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yo man, i got the GT dash wired up over the weekend so i have everything proper, engine light comes on, but when i tested it, ..." i pulled out the speed sensor connector " to see if i got any codes, but the engine light blinked normal ?..i drove the car with it diss con, for a while b4.


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Aarong420
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 15, 2007 1:49 pm 
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also the tach reads me bouncing tach at 7 sumthin, not 8200....so im confused


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Aarong420
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PostPosted: Mon Jul 23, 2007 10:08 am 
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I dissconnected the TPS plug and found the engine check light to be working correctly. But why when I drive the car and the engine light comes on, it doesnt save the code to be read afterwards.


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Hook
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 19, 2008 3:51 pm 
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waay..I now seeing this question

it prolly needs to be driven in test mode to pick it up..there's a write-up on it in the BT service manual in the diagnostic section

apparently some faults don't trigger the CEL immediately but are either stored, or the car needs to be driven in testmode to pick it up...dunno why they did it like that


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Dave-ve
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PostPosted: Fri Apr 11, 2008 9:35 pm 
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does anyone know of any diagnostic software that works with the asian market toyotas? almost all that I've found so far are only guarenteed to work on the US market cars.


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shem_lexluger
PostPosted: Sat Jan 08, 2011 11:52 am 
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Hi,

I know this is 4 years old, but I'm replying to the original post regarding the VSS troubleshooting. And I'm a newbie :)

I think I'm experiencing something similar with my Blacktop 20V right now. When the CEL came up, did you feel any sudden effect on your car like power loss or did you feel perfectly normal? I'm feeling the latter.

Another thing, I read that the VSS in general is used to support ABS. Is this also the case with 4AGE? The transplant job I had didn't include any ABS, it was just engine and fuel pump. So if this is true, then the CEL issue regarding VSS can be ignored?

Gurus, please advise.


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turbohead
PostPosted: Sun Jan 09, 2011 9:31 pm 
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having a problem with a 20v, when goin into kick down the car hold back sputters an then goes again. at first i thought was plugs as the man had in some 5's in it and it was pinging, my padnas who were working on the car serviced injectors, replaced fuel filter, and regular service. they retarded the timing and they said the pinging eased up, car i using premium. they called me and told me when they unjacked the solenoid for the vvt they said the car worked fine, i am tinking it is a fuel problem as the man said he didnt no if they person who installed the engine replaced the original pump and well the guy who installed is dead now i am yet to check the fuel issue, anyone ever came across this as yet?


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Hook
PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 9:49 am 
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shem_lexluger wrote:
Hi,

I know this is 4 years old, but I'm replying to the original post regarding the VSS troubleshooting. And I'm a newbie :)

I think I'm experiencing something similar with my Blacktop 20V right now. When the CEL came up, did you feel any sudden effect on your car like power loss or did you feel perfectly normal? I'm feeling the latter.

Another thing, I read that the VSS in general is used to support ABS. Is this also the case with 4AGE? The transplant job I had didn't include any ABS, it was just engine and fuel pump. So if this is true, then the CEL issue regarding VSS can be ignored?

Gurus, please advise.


In the time that my VSS wasn't properly connected, I had no real issues w.r.t. with the car (I mean, other than an annoying light and a lower rev cut) AND I had no speed cut, but I got an error light for it all the time. It's not something I play with really because if the CEL comes on, I don't want to be complacent and assume it's a VSS issue and ignore it when it could well be something else so I connected it properly for peace of mind.

This caused me to restore speed cut, BUT, only about the middle of last year I had an issue with the car and had to drop it off by a mechanic, who for some reason connected my fuel pump relay direct to ignition instead of through the ECU (there's a pin from the ECU that goes to the fuel pump which apparently switches off the pump when speed cut is activated). Speed cut gone once again and no VSS error codes.


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Hook
PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 9:51 am 
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turbohead, 20V silvertop or blacktop?


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turbohead
PostPosted: Mon Jan 10, 2011 7:58 pm 
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blacktop hook forgot to mention dat


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Hook
PostPosted: Tue Jan 11, 2011 10:53 am 
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I'm thinking it's a fuel issue as well. If you can reproduce the problem in neutral, maybe a FP gauge might reveal a problem in the rail which could point to a bad pump, bad FPR or bad MAP sensor. Of those three, only the MAP sensor would throw an error code and it has to be pretty far gone to throw a code.

I'm a tad confused that disconnecting the VVT solenoid gets rid of the problem unless there's a short in the solenoid coils (which SHOULD trigger an error code) or a really far gone VVT gear that doesn't engage the cam overlap when it should causing the extra fuel that engages during VVT to bog down the engine for a second.
Does the VVT gear rattle like crazy at idle and ease up at around 2500rpm? If so, and you notice that VVT isn't as agressive/noticeable as before (remember it's a mid-range power-adder so it's not nearly as aggressively noticeable as VTEC but you do hear and feel a difference) and cam timing is correct, you may have a bad VVT gear. It's tricky to get one in good condition, cuz it's a trial and error process really (and very labour intensive).

Try as much as possible to first eliminate fueling as a source of error. Balance the ITB's as per the service manual, check plugs and wires and pretty much set back everything to stock settings before troubleshooting.
Believe it or not, it could be as simple as a vacuum leak. There's a network of vacuum tubes and check valves below the ITBs that most people tend to take for granted so don't ignore those.
But you know what u doing already...start with the simple stuff first.


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turbohead
PostPosted: Wed Jan 12, 2011 10:10 pm 
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there is the rattling but most 20v i came across does this some fellas told me that its the extra valve does make noise, i didnt understand that reason but i said aite. i will check it out an get back to you


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Hook
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 22, 2011 10:56 am 
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:bump:


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trdboy
PostPosted: Fri Nov 04, 2011 11:20 pm 
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hook i got one for u bro, getting a hard start on a gt ae92 in the morning, its got a 16v 4age, ects tranny and after i cross 3000 rpm the check light comes on solid but the car pulls great and working good especially on power mode, the idling however is sometimes very low, which sensor u think might be playing up there?


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Hook
PostPosted: Sat Nov 05, 2011 10:57 am 
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The only way to know is to jump those terminals and check the error code meng. I really cyar speculate on whether the error light at 3000rpm and the loopy idle could be related.

IIRC, you should still be able to jump it from the ECU pinouts even if your diagnostic port isn't properly connected. The pinouts should be on the board when you open the ECU if you don't have a pinout diagram.


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kpanictt
PostPosted: Sat Sep 07, 2013 7:27 pm 
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Universal 4-wire narrowband lambda sensors are usually the zirconia type (it generates voltage, so two wires are for heater, one's sensor signal and the other's ground), however a lot of Toyota 4-wire sensors are the titania type which is a resistance type sensor and relies on a reference voltage sent from the ECU (two wires are heater, one's a signal wire and one's NOT ground, but has a voltage).
The two types are not interchangeable.


Based on your findings- in which category does the 4age 20v silvertop o2 sensor fall?


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Hook
PostPosted: Sat Sep 07, 2013 7:54 pm 
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For the silvertop, titania. There's definitely a 1v on the fourth wire.

I've seen a video where a person grounded the fourth wire for a sensor swap on a blacktop, which suggests it's a zirconia type, but I've never had reason to check it myself.


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