2012 Honda Civic Si vs. 2012 MazdaSpeed3

ingalook · Postby **ingalook** » September 28th, 2011, 8:59 pm

http://www.autoguide.com/manufacturer/m ... -1609.html

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ElR3VsTxnF4[/youtube]

Sky · Postby **Sky** » September 28th, 2011, 11:08 pm

62 horses less and 2 seconds slower on a track with a lot of straights. Interesting.
Think Classic would sell this though?

Not being a fanboy, but I would choose the Si over the MS3. The driver in the video should know that the stock breathers mask the vtec sound he missed in the car. And he should know if the Si does I/E alone it'll beat the MS3 on that track.

ingalook · Postby **ingalook** » September 28th, 2011, 11:54 pm

One BIG issue is that the engine can't rev over 7200rpm Where is the fun in that

Other than that there is the fact that the Ford Mustang 302 V8 makes more NA hp/liter than a civic Si... that sheit just sad

Being very fortunate to have a Honda that revs well past 8000rpm I can tell you that these engines sound their best as the revs past 7500k, so to just slap an intake and exhaust on the thing and expect it to scream like a b18c is wishfull thinking.

Also mentioned is the tuning potential of the Masdaspeed, want 50 more horses? Just up the boost, possibly add a FMIC, 50 more horses in the Honda not going to be that simple... but clearly the Honda would benefit immensely from better tires and upgraded suspension.

But for cars that supposedly cost the same, tested as they come from the factory, I'm afraid I'd take the Mazda (I'd swap out that grill though :shock:

)

Sky · Postby **Sky** » September 29th, 2011, 8:36 am

Hmm, wasn't aware of the K24 redline. I guess they traded high revs for torque. Honda sold out yes.
And as for the mustang beating it with hp/ltr, that's ok, Honda held it down for about 2 decades.
But y'know what, someone needs to shoot whoever in Honda that's only focussing on emissions.
They went for power and economy for a long time and did well. Now they will lose their fan base if they don't quit it.

honda hoe · Postby **honda hoe** » September 29th, 2011, 10:44 am

sorry to say but after 2006 when they discontinued the DC5 and the NSX-R, honda has gone to the dogs

noshownogo · Postby **noshownogo** » September 29th, 2011, 10:53 am

^BS and you know it, man make an obvious omission to rile me

Sky · Postby **Sky** » September 29th, 2011, 11:16 am

I think he's right. That was my point. They're way too emissions oriented now and their cars not kickin ace like they used to. Instead of using their technology for efficiency, they're using it for emissions, steups. Stacking VTC with DOHCVTEC made the ultimate jaliter. What they doing with it now? Goin green steups.

noshownogo · Postby **noshownogo** » September 29th, 2011, 12:42 pm

This is the last great honda:

production ended 2010

but rumour has it that the NSX project is back in the works, so performance Honda's may very well have it's resurgence! As of right now tho, I agree.

shady23 · Postby **shady23** » September 29th, 2011, 6:46 pm

That civic ugly like fcuk. Ain't catching me dead in that.

CD4Accord · Postby **CD4Accord** » October 2nd, 2011, 12:09 am

I have actually driven both within the last 4 months in the US..
You are comparing two cars in two different leagues..

Yes the Civic Si is somewhat sporty and has a fair amount of power, but it is in NO way comparable to the mazdaspeed3..

Forget just the power figures but the power delivery of the speed3 is MUCH more immediate despite the turbo, the brakes are significantly more powerful and the short shifter feels much better than the almost stock-throw in the civic...
Most of all, the fact that you are not in a civic means that you will get much less accusations of ricing out your ride even if you do extensive modification to it....

The only problem i found with the speed3 is a bit of torque steer for drag starts, but thats just the consequence of too much power through the front too quickly.. only fwd that has been able to really get past this is the Ford Focus RS..

Overall, Speed3 anyday

Samiir_Tuner · Postby **Samiir_Tuner** » October 2nd, 2011, 1:05 am

ive heard from a few ppl that the blocks in the speed3 are not exactly lovers to more power but i dont own one so i wont comment..this 9thgen Si is a complete waste. the 8th gen on the other hand with the k20z3 is fantastic..ppl underrate these motors a lot! i know this is not stock for stock, but the z3 lovesss boost because of how well the head flows..ill be posting a build thread soon with my stock z3 hoping to make 450whp stock motor

CD4Accord · Postby **CD4Accord** » October 2nd, 2011, 11:20 pm

The counterargument is that some people do no like having to rev their vehicles up to 8k and 9k to build power.. I am not saying that I mind, but honda had the same problem with the K20 and F20C in the US...
Eventually they had to stroke the motor to give some torque at lower revs at a sacrifice of maybe 1000rpm..

My friend who test drove the 2010 Si with me actually disliked the civic just because of how much he had to be on the throttle to really ring power out of the engine.. You can't really short shift at all in the Si or you will fall off the power band rather quickly..

Samiir_Tuner · Postby **Samiir_Tuner** » October 2nd, 2011, 11:45 pm

Yea I agree with u but then there is the crowd that loves winding up to 8000+rpm. But honestly with a couple bolt ons and a good tune the midrange u can get out of the k20 is decent. But then again that's not stock. I drove a stock ms3 and man after 5500rpm that thing was dead.

DSM_05 · Postby **DSM_05** » October 6th, 2011, 6:37 am

Hmm, wasn't aware of the K24 redline. I guess they traded high revs for torque. Honda sold out yes.

Remember they first started doing that with the early S2000's. Back then, people felt it hard to rev to 9k to get the power they needed (laziness? lack of intelligence as to a high revving n/a engine?) so honda went and bumped up displacement, and I think they dropped the redline too.

Yea I agree with u but then there is the crowd that loves winding up to 8000+rpm.

True. but unfortunately the masses seem to want to have instant power from 2k rpm. And if they don't have that, the car is "slow". hence, honda is playing the larger displacement/torque game to ease those concerns.