So I am going to write this post and who ever vex loss because we can't have honest competitors who are following all the rules and then have others who are blatantly cheating and further more have people scrutineer on the day and not picking up on obvious infringements that would put cars in higher classes than they are requesting to be put in.
This is the second time I have had to point out cars that have been incorrectly classed to the officials and I think something needs to be done to put a stop to this. Had I not said anything nothing would have been done. Clearly leaving it open to honesty by the drivers is not working because these two times that I pointed out errors the drivers are well aware of what their cars have yet said nothing.
Yesterday a subaru impreza was put in SS class, the argument being the car was classed there from the beginning of the year. It is clear that work has been done to this car from that time to now and it is no longer an SS car, my guess is not even an EP car. The car has from what I understand at least coil over suspension which puts 3 points on it immediately, it only requires one more point to be put out of SS and into EP. I think the people doing the srcutineering need to be more aware and when a car like this is within 1 point of being bumped extra attention needs to be placed. A simple knowledge of what carries points could have easily seen this car has other mods that will surely add 1 more penalty point and put it out of SS class yet this was not done and the car allowed to run SS on the day.
The car in question not only needs to be scrutineered properly for modifications as per the solodex penalty point system but it also needs to be re-dyno'd to establish base class since I know the car is much quicker than it was at the beginning of the year, you don't even need a dyno to notice that. If paying the protest fee is required to do that I am more than willing to pay it because this kind of stuff has to stop or things put in place to greatly reduce it.
Boost controllers attract points. Not saying it was done here but a wastegate actuator or even the spring in it can be replaced after to turn up the boost. Car can be tuned to run very rich AFRs on the dyno and lose power then go back after and clean it up to make the correct amount.
Honesty really should be the most important thing. If your car goes on the dyno and is borderline in a class and then you go do work on it, you should step up and say what you've done and either go up in class or go back on the dyno to see if you're still ok.
what you are saying is true Pete and Neil, this really cannot be stopped BUT my point is this was not even needed in both instances that I pointed out cars should be in higher classes than they were. The scrutineerer could have picked up on them and tallied the points and advanced the cars in class.
Lots of things attract points and the rules are not being properly enforced. Take a vtec controller for instance.....all it takes is for those hondas to have something that is capable of altering their vtec engagement point and that warrants a penalty......I am sure if you tally the points for most of the "suped" up hondas that was left out and hence the car's again incorrectly classed.
The back of the sign up forms should be used when scrutineering all the cars on the day and the person doing the job should quickly run through the list and visually checking the car for any of these things, when in doubt ask the driver face to face right there and then......its much more difficult for these people to watch you and lie rather than just not say anything and cheat because no one asks the question.
It does happen a lot, but look how easily I spotted cars that are not correctly classed and I neither an official that should be actively involved with competitors nor someone who scrutineers the cars......the rules just need to be enforced properly......if men find ways the cheat despite this then well I guess they will keep fooling themselves, but as it is now it is too easy.
When this subaru is fould guilty of breaching the rules and running in the incorrect class I also hope the committee abides to the following rules from the rulle book:
"If a car is found to be outside of its class at any time during the competition year because of a modification change or classification error (as opposed to false declarations), that car would be retroactively re-classed"
"Championship points earned will be recalculated based on the bump, and any trophies won by the competitor(s) during the year must be surrendered for redistribution to the competitor(s) who would have held the finishing position of the incorrectly classed car at the various events."
And pete that car has a boost controller on it which is penalized as 3 points, this together with coil overs which is 3 points has already thrown this car out of SS group without even having to re-dyno.
Another rule that is not being enforced.....many people at dex running LSD's and not being penalized. The rules are both an OEM and aftermarket LSD is to be penalized.
"LSD - OEM / Aftermarket(Eg: 4WD –2 LSD’s – 4 points) - 2 points if only one."
So what about all the civics that come with LSD??? Are points awarded to these cars?
What about the "stock evos and subaurs?" Are points being awarded to these cars?
If I look to call names everybody will vex with me, but I know many men not abiding by these rules and declaring them but instead just staying quiet because nobody asking.
Well pete that LSD is the reason the other car I flagged to the officials was running a class lower than it should have been. Whether or not it is tallied for Moses I do not know.
What I am certain of is that most of those hondas have hondatas that are capable of altering their vtec and as such should be penalized because whether the owners admit it or not I can guess with almost 100% accuracy that none of them have the vtec set to come in where it was at the factory.
If you read the rules carefully, it outlines vtec/vvti etc controllers and boost controllers as penalties even if the person may not have altered the set points you get penalized for it because the possibility exists for the owner to be dishonest and turn the boost up or alter the vtec and nobody will ever know. I know for a fact THIS rule is not being implemented across the board.
Altering the vtec engagement point doesn't do much to improve performance... In fact it might have the opposite effect and cost you power. .. but that is another story But a boost controller. .... That can affect power levels some
there are ways to increase boost without using a controller eh...how is this trapped with regards to classing?? evo 7 and up as well as 2001 subarus up can be open sourced tuned...you can also run dual maps off the factory ecu, launch control etc....
Only way a vtec controller would affect the power is if it is off and never comes in. Did not know all the subarus could be flashed. So should all get points for that? What if someone comes to the dyno with the same tune they race with? Should they then de-tune for the dyno?
IMHO if someone really needs to cheat that badly to win, a better driver in a properly classed car would probably still beat them.
The classification system is not perfect but to me it's better than a purely cc rating system where you have 100hp cars racing against 185hp cars in 1600cc or 500hp awd cars racing against 250hp rwd cars.
One thing I always wanted to know, do points carry over from one class to the next? Or once you bump class is the slate wiped?
Because for instance the first class bump is 4 points, say someone has coilovers that is 3 points already, then say they have another mod which is worth 2 points.......do they get bumped to the next class and carry the 1 point?
I think the rule should be that you carry the point because wiping the slate clean every class bump doesn't make sense IMO.