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Official VAG DSG/Dual Clutch Transmission Thread

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neexis
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Official VAG DSG/Dual Clutch Transmission Thread

Postby neexis » March 11th, 2014, 11:50 pm

Just creating this thread specifically to discuss Volkswagen Group Dual Clutch Transmission (DSG, S-Tronic, etc) related info/issues/experiences since we all kinda post that stuff in Allergic's Jetta thread.
Last edited by neexis on March 12th, 2014, 12:03 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Official VAG DSG/Dual Clutch Transmission Thread

Postby neexis » March 12th, 2014, 12:00 am

@fastredcar : sorry to hear bout the DSG problems. Please keep us posted on how it turns out.

As for me, my 2013 Passat 1.8TSI/DSG7 just hit 20,000 miles after 13 months. I find now there's a bit of a judder going from D1 to D2. This usually happens when the the gear changes to D2 too quickly and I hit the gas too much, or in cases when I think the car is trying to take off in D2 at too low a speed (eg. coming off a speed bump).

When the speed drops below even 15 km/h, the car still does not gear down to D1, and still tries to continue in D2. This is when the shudder is most noticeable. I am able to overcome this by going easy on the gas to let the speed slowly increase past 20-25km/h, throwing it into manual, or even sport mode. It's not a major issue (yet), but this wasn't happening 6 months ago.

I am wondering if a DSG tune will rectify this. Eco?

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Re: Official VAG DSG/Dual Clutch Transmission Thread

Postby EcoTune Trinidad » March 12th, 2014, 6:20 am

neexis wrote:Just creating this thread specifically to discuss Volkswagen Group Dual Clutch Transmission (DSG, S-Tronic, etc) related info/issues/experiences since we all kinda post that stuff in Allergic's Jetta thread.


Yup...the DSG tune would allow the gear to downshift into first....and engine tune will do the same as more torque is applied lower in the rpm...in the interim drive the car in tip mode for a few days and the judder will go away.....it's good practice to do this from time to time if you use D gear alot for city traffic...This has also helped sramoutar from the forum

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Re: Official VAG DSG/Dual Clutch Transmission Thread

Postby neexis » March 13th, 2014, 5:59 am

Actually, I drop into manual mode quite regularly.... maybe even daily.
I find when I do this sometimes, the D1 to D2 transition behaves the way I would like it to, and then sometimes not really.

Is that premature acceleration from D2 with the juddering placing extra strain on the 2nd gear and transmission as a whole?
Can the DSG tune then ensure less wear on D2?

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Re: Official VAG DSG/Dual Clutch Transmission Thread

Postby EcoTune Trinidad » March 13th, 2014, 8:24 pm

neexis wrote:Actually, I drop into manual mode quite regularly.... maybe even daily.
I find when I do this sometimes, the D1 to D2 transition behaves the way I would like it to, and then sometimes not really.

Is that premature acceleration from D2 with the juddering placing extra strain on the 2nd gear and transmission as a whole?
Can the DSG tune then ensure less wear on D2?




Do you hammer the throttle in tip mode?This ideally should do the trick,as if moderate driving in tip mode won't do much to alleviate symptoms IMO...

In D2 the torque is too low for OEM operation....ever notice when in tiptronic 2nd gear, the applied engine torque is different (higher) than in D2?

The thing is when the engine is tuned the torque is brought lower down the rpm range thus virtually eliminating the "so called shudder" effect...same can be done for DSG Tune...In either case the Clutch wear is lowered in this instance, but I'm not in a position to say by what percentage...hope I answered your question..

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Re: Official VAG DSG/Dual Clutch Transmission Thread

Postby fastredcar » March 13th, 2014, 8:39 pm

Hi guys..

Yeah I used to experience judderring...loss of power..clankering of the underside where the transmission is..and all that they told me at the firm that is how it is supposed to be.

I say what?! Ah say alright..no scene, now there is a mechatronics issue...

Them is kix yes

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Re: Official VAG DSG/Dual Clutch Transmission Thread

Postby neexis » March 14th, 2014, 6:01 am

EcoTune Trinidad wrote:
neexis wrote:Do you hammer the throttle in tip mode?This ideally should do the trick,as if moderate driving in tip mode won't do much to alleviate symptoms IMO...

In D2 the torque is too low for OEM operation....ever notice when in tiptronic 2nd gear, the applied engine torque is different (higher) than in D2?

The thing is when the engine is tuned the torque is brought lower down the rpm range thus virtually eliminating the "so called shudder" effect...same can be done for DSG Tune...In either case the Clutch wear is lowered in this instance, but I'm not in a position to say by what percentage...hope I answered your question..


Yep, sometimes in manual I ride those gears hard.

Yeah it's true what you say about the applied torque in 2 vs D2. And even so, in manual, it downshifts automatically so you don't take off on too low a gear. In manual, once it's below 20 km/h it shifts back to 1 automatically, which I think is how it should be.

@fastredcar did your clanking get worse coming closer to failure? Even VW says some is normal due to the clutch design. I have never really heard any from my car though.

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Re: Official VAG DSG/Dual Clutch Transmission Thread

Postby syncrod » March 14th, 2014, 6:22 am

subscribed :)

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Re: Official VAG DSG/Dual Clutch Transmission Thread

Postby fastredcar » March 14th, 2014, 11:31 am

@neexis

Well for me, its whenever I drive over rough, or humps etc.. it rattles like if something needs tightening. But they said its normal, but it makes my car sound really old...a few other VW owners always question me about it because they don't have it on theirs..

Oh well...

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Re: Official VAG DSG/Dual Clutch Transmission Thread

Postby Allergic2BunnyEars » March 14th, 2014, 12:04 pm

That's just how it is basically. Test drive another dq200 equipped car and chances are you will hear the same sounds. I'm pretty sure when you get back your car it will sound the same.

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Re: Official VAG DSG/Dual Clutch Transmission Thread

Postby karl » March 14th, 2014, 9:54 pm

.....
Last edited by karl on May 4th, 2017, 6:57 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Official VAG DSG/Dual Clutch Transmission Thread

Postby Krystal Car Part Imports » March 15th, 2014, 5:15 pm

I have read something in Daily Mail, that VW now recommends the use of mineral oil over the previous hi-tech synthetic oil in the DQ200 DSG unit, after reports of failures in australia, middle east and south east asia. These failures are not shared in UK and western Europe. VW says the mineral oil should correct the DSG problems, including sudden loss of power

However, what mineral oil are they speaking of?


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Re: Official VAG DSG/Dual Clutch Transmission Thread

Postby Allergic2BunnyEars » March 15th, 2014, 6:35 pm

kantoine wrote:I have read something in Daily Mail, that VW now recommends the use of mineral oil over the previous hi-tech synthetic oil in the DQ200 DSG unit, after reports of failures in australia, middle east and south east asia. These failures are not shared in UK and western Europe. VW says the mineral oil should correct the DSG problems, including sudden loss of power

However, what mineral oil are they speaking of?


Mineral oil VW part number : G052512A2

viewtopic.php?f=38&t=397860&p=7685575&hilit=mineral#p7685575

This is preventative I believe. If you mechatronic unit went kaput switching to this oil at that point won't fix the issue.

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Re: Official VAG DSG/Dual Clutch Transmission Thread

Postby Krystal Car Part Imports » March 15th, 2014, 11:11 pm

Allergic2BunnyEars wrote:
kantoine wrote:I have read something in Daily Mail, that VW now recommends the use of mineral oil over the previous hi-tech synthetic oil in the DQ200 DSG unit, after reports of failures in australia, middle east and south east asia. These failures are not shared in UK and western Europe. VW says the mineral oil should correct the DSG problems, including sudden loss of power

However, what mineral oil are they speaking of?


Mineral oil VW part number : G052512A2

viewtopic.php?f=38&t=397860&p=7685575&hilit=mineral#p7685575

This is preventative I believe. If you mechatronic unit went kaput switching to this oil at that point won't fix the issue.


Correct, you would need a replacement unit.

From what I understand, the synthetic oil causes crystals to be formed on the unit, which then damages the electronics. You all know this already. Question is, has the mineral oil in newer cars solved the problem of breaking units?

Well. the score is

Mineral oil-1, Synthetic Oil-0

I knew synthetic oil has its limitations. lol

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Re: Official VAG DSG/Dual Clutch Transmission Thread

Postby Allergic2BunnyEars » March 15th, 2014, 11:48 pm

Just have to wait and see I guess. On international forums most of the 7 speed dsg complaints threads dried up after the recalls so it's a waiting game to see if the problem is really solved. I suspect it is. My question is how come cars locally never ever ever seem to fall under recalls lol.

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Re: Official VAG DSG/Dual Clutch Transmission Thread

Postby 4Motion » March 16th, 2014, 11:30 am

Allergic2BunnyEars wrote:Just have to wait and see I guess. On international forums most of the 7 speed dsg complaints threads dried up after the recalls so it's a waiting game to see if the problem is really solved. I suspect it is. My question is how come cars locally never ever ever seem to fall under recalls lol.


Interesting that you bring that up. When my Tiguan went in for service a couple of weeks ago my fuze box was replaced free of charge due to the worldwide recall because fuze box melting etc. But it was all very hush hush. I wasn't informed, it was written on my bill in a very vague way that most wouldn't pick up on unless you follow the recalls.

A bit off topic but I've found the service at Best Auto has really deteriorated in the last 2 years. After numerous complaints nothing has been done to improve it. I mean seriously a basic service these days takes 2 days.

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Re: Official VAG DSG/Dual Clutch Transmission Thread

Postby Allergic2BunnyEars » March 16th, 2014, 1:32 pm

4Motion wrote:
Allergic2BunnyEars wrote:Just have to wait and see I guess. On international forums most of the 7 speed dsg complaints threads dried up after the recalls so it's a waiting game to see if the problem is really solved. I suspect it is. My question is how come cars locally never ever ever seem to fall under recalls lol.


Interesting that you bring that up. When my Tiguan went in for service a couple of weeks ago my fuze box was replaced free of charge due to the worldwide recall because fuze box melting etc. But it was all very hush hush. I wasn't informed, it was written on my bill in a very vague way that most wouldn't pick up on unless you follow the recalls.

A bit off topic but I've found the service at Best Auto has really deteriorated in the last 2 years. After numerous complaints nothing has been done to improve it. I mean seriously a basic service these days takes 2 days.


If you can you should post up the invoice with the relevant info. Never know who might find it useful just incase someone forgets to do their job at the dealership.

I emailed vw directly for recall info on my vehicle with respect to the worldwide dq200 recall due to a lack of concrete info from the dealer locally. They responded via email to state that the recall didn't affect my vehicle. On one hand I would say it is strange not even mk5 jettas don't fall under the recall and to blame the dealer for not following up but then they do the right thing with your fuse box. Without more feedback from other owners it's hard to say what is really going on...

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Re: Official VAG DSG/Dual Clutch Transmission Thread

Postby neexis » March 17th, 2014, 6:21 am

4Motion wrote:A bit off topic but I've found the service at Best Auto has really deteriorated in the last 2 years. After numerous complaints nothing has been done to improve it. I mean seriously a basic service these days takes 2 days.


I've been dealing with them for a year now and service has been ok since.
By basic service do you mean oil/filter change?
If so, I usually book that about a week in advance and I let them know I'm waiting for the car. I've never had to wait more than 2 hours from check in to driving out.


WRT my DSG judder, I ran it in manual a few times really hard (1st and 2nd gear to redline till they changed automatically). This has seemed to decrease the judder a bit. It's still there but not as bad. I suppose that's what Eco meant when he said "hammer it".

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Re: Official VAG DSG/Dual Clutch Transmission Thread

Postby EcoTune Trinidad » March 17th, 2014, 11:52 pm

Correct...for me its good practice once in a while with the kind of traffic we encounter...

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Re: Official VAG DSG/Dual Clutch Transmission Thread

Postby neexis » March 19th, 2014, 6:21 am

Eco I think what you should have said was: put it in manual, and gheee fyazzz

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Re: Official VAG DSG/Dual Clutch Transmission Thread

Postby EcoTune Trinidad » March 19th, 2014, 6:27 am

Twas understood neexis :).....other unfortunate news....

Thought I had received the update by now for tuning cthd 1.4tsi....turns out it was only after opening up my ecu did I realize the processor chip on my ecu board was the most current one...

Long story short, gotta wait for a while until tunes available for my engine...stueps

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Re: Official VAG DSG/Dual Clutch Transmission Thread

Postby 4Motion » March 19th, 2014, 9:59 am

neexis wrote: I've been dealing with them for a year now and service has been ok since.
By basic service do you mean oil/filter change?
If so, I usually book that about a week in advance and I let them know I'm waiting for the car. I've never had to wait more than 2 hours from check in to driving out.


Depends on the service but yes even on the oil/filter change. I can assure you if you keep your VW for another 3-4 years Best Auto will make you never own another one again. I kinda wish the Skoda Yeti was on the market when I bought my Tig as my service experience with Sterling has been great when I owned a Skoda Octavia 1.8T for 7 years. Maybe I should special order one with all the leather and luxury features.

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Re: Official VAG DSG/Dual Clutch Transmission Thread

Postby neexis » March 20th, 2014, 5:26 am

EcoTune Trinidad wrote:Twas understood neexis :).....other unfortunate news....

Thought I had received the update by now for tuning cthd 1.4tsi....turns out it was only after opening up my ecu did I realize the processor chip on my ecu board was the most current one...

Long story short, gotta wait for a while until tunes available for my engine...stueps


and what of the DSG tuning?

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Re: Official VAG DSG/Dual Clutch Transmission Thread

Postby EcoTune Trinidad » March 20th, 2014, 6:22 am

neexis wrote:
EcoTune Trinidad wrote:Twas understood neexis :).....other unfortunate news....

Thought I had received the update by now for tuning cthd 1.4tsi....turns out it was only after opening up my ecu did I realize the processor chip on my ecu board was the most current one...

Long story short, gotta wait for a while until tunes available for my engine...stueps


and what of the DSG tuning?


Awaiting my dealer network to start distributing cabling, will update the thread once in hand...seeign some interesting features in some screenshots like increasing downshift & upshiftshift speed & response with my paddle shifters, separately from the shifter, lifting the RPM from the DSG standpoint...so looks really promising....curious to try this with an engine tune....

I know the BEST Auto Jetta will really benefit from that DSG tune also, so looking into that one as the engine is tuned more aggressively than standard offerings :D

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Re: Official VAG DSG/Dual Clutch Transmission Thread

Postby fastredcar » March 20th, 2014, 10:12 pm

Guys..I am still awaiting an update on the order of my mechatronic unit. Will keep you all posted.

Good to know that the rattle and stuff is normal, was getting a bit worried there.

@EcoTune

I would be checking when my warranty is up to do some tuning ok?!

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Re: Official VAG DSG/Dual Clutch Transmission Thread

Postby EcoTune Trinidad » March 21st, 2014, 12:11 am

When ya ready bro

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Re: Official VAG DSG/Dual Clutch Transmission Thread

Postby fastredcar » March 21st, 2014, 10:47 pm

Nice!

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Re: Official VAG DSG/Dual Clutch Transmission Thread

Postby karl » March 29th, 2014, 11:03 am

.....
Last edited by karl on May 4th, 2017, 6:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Official VAG DSG/Dual Clutch Transmission Thread

Postby Allergic2BunnyEars » March 29th, 2014, 2:34 pm

It's just catching it's breath after dem hard runs you does do :lol:

I've never heard mine do this but I've also never checked. Is it loud?

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