Moderator: 3ne2nr Mods
Link wrote:I state categorically that TTASA has NOT RECEIVED ANY FUNDING FROM MSYA.
Like you, I am also curious about
Link wrote:WHY ???
If you stand OUTSIDE the National Sport Policy umbrella, how can you ethically seek the same opportunities as those who embrace the collective 'way forward' ??
pete wrote:Link, what it all comes down to is this.
What can TTRC and all the other non-affiliated groups gain by joining / affiliating themselves with TTASA?
TTASA has a LOT to gain by them joining and from where I am, it seems that ALL the other groups want is some change in structure of TTASA that would ensure equal representation for each branch of the sport.
Until then y'all can keep saying "allyuh have to join us or else" and they will keep putting on events and getting the job done. If TTASA would agree to subtle changes that would get the other groups to join then the whole sport can move forward.
Those other groups that have come together for the love of the sport don't want to see years and years of hard work disappear by people who aren't willing to negotiate a solution that will benefit everyone.
BANzai Rastafarai wrote:SR wrote:roflmao
never happen
too many years of personal bitterness
Actually SR,
it can happen. Look at Taroba Stadium...ALOT of pockets/prado/Cayenne got bought with that insane project, only for it to be classed as a "prision" in the end...and that was just a stadium...thnik of all the contracts and corruption that will take place with the construction of the facility....Anil wants it cuz he already has the facilities company set up (not in his name...but it is set up...*it pays to drunken one of his executive assistanst in Riverwood...lol)) so that he has a money post Govt appointment.
Think about it....a half mile strip (1.4 mile track plus another 1/8 to 1/4 run-off track)...we measure it already (2007)...you talkin gabout lighting, civi works, ashplaht laying, Stands creation, actual Facilities buildings (Garages, Admins building, possiblby a 3 story structure with VIP lounges and Food canteens), mini tracks for drifting and karting and the view of a possible circuit track....
You have project management costs, IT support costs, civic works support costs, administrative costs, enviromental compliance costs...
BILLIONS...that construction will eclipse the 700million build for the POint Highway.
So yeah... Give Anil his way, sod turning ceremony will take place and money will start to flow to get "Party Contributors Pockets" fat again. It would be stupud NOT To construct it....as for the administration....Anil can sing that song of "allaince" till the construction is nearly over...IF he is still in power, then he looks like a Porn Star that can bul lfor hours....if his govt gets out of power...evn then..he still has that in his hat to tout....
We fail to see the bigger picture that is waaaaaaaaaaay out of many of our pay grade.
X2 wrote:It will be hard to push a $700Mm project thru Ministry of Sport. Especially without a realistic plan for revenue recovery of such a large investment. A drag track alone would be in excess of $60mm with today's RM prices. Even that much wasn't spent on swimming, netball, cycling and boxing combined (as far as I know).
For goverment to pay for anything significant...motorsport either needs to be a deeply entrenched sport with direct, visible revenue generation (foreign investment, tourism, technology investment, etc....) or it will need to be handled as a private business with payouts from the ministry for different levels of assistance, yet be self sustaining.
Just this past Friday, Anil was answering some queries regarding MoS expenditure as of Dec 2011. Somewhere in his philibuster must have mentioned monies going to autosport... *cough*wheeze*clears throat*... ahem... I mean... 'motorsport'. So what has been given this year (by the ministry) for events and prizegiving... for awards, trophies, travel for racing abroad ? Surely sheldon got a lil something to help him parade our flag while breaking records around the world ? Right ? Anil ?
Or not... lol
to be fair to anil he always says when interviewed "with the support of the private sector" eh...he never says the govt doing it by deyself
to be fair to anil
UML wrote:
it eh start yet and he criticizing....criticizing it eh build yet.....criticizing before it build.....criticizing if it ever build.
damned it u do.....damned if u dont
RIPEBREDFRUIT wrote:JUST BUILD the frigging MOTOR sport facility and then you all can fight over it.
At least people who would like a chance to time , run and tune their cars can then do so under LEGAL procedures.
All of this was covered already.gt4tified wrote:Further to pete’s questions,
What can the non-affiliated groups gain by joining/affiliating themselves with the MGC and how is this supposed to be different from affiliation with TTASA? Or is it some mechanism where non-affiliate groups can enjoy some benefit that is separate and apart from the ‘benefits’ offered by TTASA? If so, what are these assumed benefits?
MGC and TTASA seems like old wine in a new bottle imo, and I can only venture a guess but maybe it is that until the non-affiliated groups get some answers, expecting them to affiliate themselves is the same as expecting a cabernet sauvignon to fall out the clouds instead of rain water.
Duane 3NE 2NR wrote:All of this was covered already.gt4tified wrote:Further to pete’s questions,
What can the non-affiliated groups gain by joining/affiliating themselves with the MGC and how is this supposed to be different from affiliation with TTASA? Or is it some mechanism where non-affiliate groups can enjoy some benefit that is separate and apart from the ‘benefits’ offered by TTASA? If so, what are these assumed benefits?
MGC and TTASA seems like old wine in a new bottle imo, and I can only venture a guess but maybe it is that until the non-affiliated groups get some answers, expecting them to affiliate themselves is the same as expecting a cabernet sauvignon to fall out the clouds instead of rain water.
I hope you are not just typing for typing sake.
If you are a member of a local motorsport club/association, the executive can also explain these things to you ask well as their stand on the issue.
What can clubs get by joining?
By having one unified group/MSGC/NSO the Ministry of Sport can wholeheartedly support all forms of motorsport in the form of concessions, subvention and funding. ALL the motorsport clubs can benefit from this, a benefit NONE of the clubs currently get openly, including TTASA or even say Solodex.
How does MGC and TTASA seems like old wine in a new bottle?
Currently the MSGC that TTASA created sits aside and below TTASA, though TTASA also sits on the MSGC they created. TTASA chaired the MSGC only up till a couple weeks ago when the president of TTUNDRA was named Chairman of the MSGC by TTASA.
Currently, in order for your association to be part of the MSGC, your club/association must become affiliates to the NSO/NGB which is TTASA.
TTASA is not the MSGC. The MSGC was created by TTASA and is made up of all the clubs/associations who are affiliated to TTASA.
The clubs/associations who are not affiliated want to join a MSGC that is completely equal to TTASA. Which is why if the MSGC became the NSO/NGB, everyone would join.
As it is TTASA holds the NSO/NGB power while affiliates sit below them on the MSGC. The MSGC cannot liaise with the Ministry of Sport directly, the NSO/NGB must do that, so everything done at MSGC level must in-turn pass through TTASA, including concessions, subvention and funding - that is the problem non-affiliate clubs have with joining the MSGC.
TTUNDRA was named Chairman of the MSGC...
The MSGC cannot liaise with the Ministry of Sport directly, the NSO/NGB must do that,
are you 100% sure that if the NGB changes but the relationship doesn't that all non-affiliates would get on board?
alot of it was answered already though. Just not directly to you.gt4tified wrote:I would not like to think that I'm typing for typing's sake. I think my questions need to be examined in context.
the benefits of operating as a unified group are infinite, most are obvious. Currently ARA, CARS and TTKA help TTRC with huge events such as Rally Trinidad, so the more the merrier. Corporate sponsors feel better when dealing with a larger, more organised body. Competitors get benefits etc etc etcgt4tified wrote:Are concessions/subventions/funding and being able to hug-up under one umbrella the only benefits of joining the MSGC?
depends on what they want funding for. They can request funding or budget allocation for a motorsport facility or for just a single event. Again that's pretty obvious and works just like any National Governing Body for sport.gt4tified wrote:What is this funding going to be used for, just staging of events or is there some agreed and established plan for Motorsport that funding is going to be directed towards?
obviously the MoS will want to see plans etc. But before you can plan you need unity so that you do not end up with 5 or 20 different "master plans".gt4tified wrote:Is it altogether unreasonable to assume that the MoS will want to see some master plan amenable to all parties before presenting funding to a Motorsport NGB whoever it may be?
But whether he is his daddy or his boss, he is still above his child or his employee. Not so?gt4tified wrote:I see it as old wine in new bottles because as it exists, the MSGC sits, notwithstanding being separate from, but UNDER TTASA. Its like a man who brings his child into the family busuness and says to them "Don't think of me as your Daddy, but only as your Boss".
as stated before the clubs want the MSGC to be the NSO however TTASA would also sit on the MSGC and retain their ASN status and in theory bring FIA benefits to the MSGC.gt4tified wrote:If TTASA were to relinquish NGB status, would that relationship between the MSGC & TTASA continue to exist as is and if so, are you 100% sure that if the NGB changes but the relationship doesn't that all non-affiliates would get on board?
obviously. It is a governing body / affiliate relationship, not really a parent / child relationship.gt4tified wrote:If the MSGC is to be the NGB, for there to be peace, the parent-child relationship between TTASA and the MSGC must cease to exist.
obviously j/kgt4tified wrote:But then again, maybe I do need to take a rest from typing...allyuh have fun.
link wrote:are you 100% sure that if the NGB changes but the relationship doesn't that all non-affiliates would get on board?
not all non-affiliates will be able to qualify for the MSGC.........
that being said...any (local) motor sport body CAN become affiliated to the (local) NGB....
.
Duane 3NE 2NR wrote:^ Acronyms:
MSGC - Motor Sport General Council
MSYA - Ministry of Sport and Youth Affairs (also referred to as MoS - Ministry of Sport)
SPORTT - Sports Company of T&T http://www.sportt-tt.com
FIA - Federation Internationale de l'Automobile (International Automobile Federation) FIFA is to football what FIA is to motorsport.
ASN - Autorite Sportive Nationale (the National Sporting Authority for the FIA in a country)
NSO - National Sporting Organisation, now known as the NGB
NGB - National Governing Body, previously known as the NSO
TTASA - Trinidad and Tobago Automobile Sports Association
TTRC - Trinidad & Tobago Rally Club (club that has Rally Trinidad, Rally Tobago etc)
ARA - AutoSport Racing Association (aka AutoSport)
CARS - Creative Auto and Recreational Sport (club that has solodex)
TTKA - Trinidad & Tobago Karting Association
TTUNDRA - T&T Unified Drag Racers Association
Plus these "non-affiliates" work very well together all the time. For rally trinidad CARS, ARA, TTORC, TTKA and Trail Blazers all work with TTRC to put on that international event.Duane 3NE 2NR wrote:TTASA Affiliates:
TTUNDRA have had zero events
Horizon Motorsport zero events
TTNSA zero events
TTRA treasure hunt fun rallies for companies
V8 Boys a few car shows
TTCKR (never heard of them till now) zero events
Not sure of the others
Registered Associations so far refusing to become affiliated to TTASA:
TTRC rally trinidad & rally tobago and national championships for 40 years
TTKA national championships for decades
CARS national championships for the past 12 years
ARA national championships for decades and even doing events in other countries, now having Drag + Wind championship
TORMATT national championships
DWO numerous events and demonstrations, club also takes part in Drag + Wind
TTORC numerous events every year
Trail Blazers 4x4 numerous events every year
TTPBA Great race, numerous regattas every year