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Official marijuana/marijuana legalization in TNT thread

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Re: Official marijuana/marijuana legalization in TNT thread

Postby DF1_2nR » April 15th, 2016, 11:02 am

So your argument against legalization is that low level dealers will be out of business?

That's kind of the point. Eliminate the illegal market as much as possible and remove the strain on the police/judiciary/prison system that comes with enforcing the archaic laws.

Legalization alone isn't the answer. Legalization along with a realistic framework for regulation,cultivation, export/distribution locally as well as regionally of cannabis and hemp based products means lots of potential jobs being created. Who better to fill the positions than the persons that were illegally involved in the industry in the first place? It's a best case scenario sure, but if you have a chance to earn a legit living doing the same things you were doing illegally why continue with the riskier avenue?

There's lots of ground work to be done of course but the end state should be a sustainable industry that once managed competently brings in billions in revenue for the country if the examples we are seeing abroad are any indication.

If only we could get the backwards politicians/religious leaders etc. to see it that way, and eliminate the "weed is the devil" mindset brought on by years of propaganda, we have a chance at being an industry leader in the region. But more than likely they won't and we'll be stuck playing catch up after the fact.

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Re: Official marijuana/marijuana legalization in TNT thread

Postby pugboy » April 15th, 2016, 3:45 pm

correct but the main question thinking forward is what are those low lever dealers/block boys going to do after ?
we know they not going to go back to school or look for meaningful jobs

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Re: RE: Re: Official marijuana/marijuana legalization in TNT thread

Postby bluesclues » April 16th, 2016, 6:42 pm

pugboy wrote:correct but the main question thinking forward is what are those low lever dealers/block boys going to do after ?
we know they not going to go back to school or look for meaningful jobs


U rong. I know some goin back to school and holding meaningful jobs right now. Most criminals do what they do because of some self justified necessity. Take away that necessity and the urge or even the will to perform crime slips away.

Ill tell u what they could do. They could go bir, and fill out tax returns stating 'they does sell weed' and income is 70k per year. And become recognized and respected entrepeneurs with maybe even business registration behind their name. Growers could start supplying herbal shops legitimately. Witco could expand it product list. To name a few.

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Re: Official marijuana/marijuana legalization in TNT thread

Postby pugboy » April 16th, 2016, 6:54 pm

nice, I glad to be wrong and wish them all the best
surely they can find meaningful employment as many business have labour shortages

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Re: RE: Re: Official marijuana/marijuana legalization in TNT thread

Postby bluesclues » April 16th, 2016, 7:52 pm

pugboy wrote:I was not being sarcastic
in all countries that have legalized weed the price dropped dramatically, google and see
simple economics of supply and demand

the high price of an illegal goods is based on the demand, supply as well as the risk required to be in that business(not get caught)
2 out of those 3 parameters will be no more so go figure....

cartels will join business on the public floor so all them block boys who were middlemen now have nothing to do...


How many years experience u have picking, cleaning, grinding and rolling weed? Same fellas can now go and work for a legitimate brick and mortar supplier. The important thing to note is that once its legal, ppl will have the law to deal with theft and fraud in weed business. So they wont have any need for a gun to sell weed because u could always just report a robbery and let the police go find the suspect, charge him and gih yuh back yuh weed. The lack of legal recourse for theft gives rise to the whole violent message sending gun toting requirements. If u get what im saying.

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Re: Official marijuana/marijuana legalization in TNT thread

Postby pugboy » April 17th, 2016, 12:30 pm

I hope you right

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Re: RE: Re: RE: Re: Official marijuana/marijuana legalization in TNT thread

Postby mero » April 17th, 2016, 1:05 pm

bluesclues wrote:
pugboy wrote:I was not being sarcastic
in all countries that have legalized weed the price dropped dramatically, google and see
simple economics of supply and demand

the high price of an illegal goods is based on the demand, supply as well as the risk required to be in that business(not get caught)
2 out of those 3 parameters will be no more so go figure....

cartels will join business on the public floor so all them block boys who were middlemen now have nothing to do...


How many years experience u have picking, cleaning, grinding and rolling weed? Same fellas can now go and work for a legitimate brick and mortar supplier. The important thing to note is that once its legal, ppl will have the law to deal with theft and fraud in weed business. So they wont have any need for a gun to sell weed because u could always just report a robbery and let the police go find the suspect, charge him and gih yuh back yuh weed. The lack of legal recourse for theft gives rise to the whole violent message sending gun toting requirements. If u get what im saying.

What perfect world u feel we living in?

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Re: Official marijuana/marijuana legalization in TNT thread

Postby bluesclues » April 17th, 2016, 7:33 pm

Wit will just be another commodity legally traded in daylight business. The violent crime prestige it attracts is only because its illegal. When a man rob yuh rum shop, u don't call your mafia henchmen for him, u call d police. Yet once upon a time when alcohol was made illegal it gave rise to the mob. And yes yuh would get kill for tiefin rum from a mob seller. So case in point, legalize it, and it will no longer have a gang association because as it is now the majority ppl who have smoked marijuana or smoke, not in no gang.

U see they does have no choice. A man rob yuh block... u can't exactly go to the police and say someone thief yuh weed. Hence you have to mete out yuh own justice to get it back. Take away that need and ull also remove the cover block robbers use to rob men of their weed. But in the absence of any legal framework, the illegal trade will naturally structure a justice system to survive on.

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Re: Official marijuana/marijuana legalization in TNT thread

Postby pugboy » April 18th, 2016, 7:31 am

yep, them boys will turn a new leaf and get accustomed to an honest 8hour day work like the rest of us

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Re: Official marijuana/marijuana legalization in TNT thread

Postby urbandilema » April 18th, 2016, 8:15 am

I did it my self two times but it isn't my recreation.i have no problem in legalize the herb.i believe it cud help alot of ppl from cancer to demintia and even depression as well as anxiety disorders.im no doctor but that's just my 2cents.

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Re: RE: Re: Official marijuana/marijuana legalization in TNT thread

Postby bluesclues » April 18th, 2016, 10:28 am

pugboy wrote:yep, them boys will turn a new leaf and get accustomed to an honest 8hour day work like the rest of us


With half decent mentors... yes. End of the day.. ask any of them if they wish they didn't have to perform crime to survive and u see in their eyes, the breakdown of the soul. A wish they just never believe will happen to them. Once they could collect enough money to survive the month there will be no crime. The problem starts when the money stops coming.. and still not coming after they ain't eat nuttin but a corn bred for the past 3 days.

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Re: Official marijuana/marijuana legalization in TNT thread

Postby MaxPower » April 18th, 2016, 10:43 am

All this to say allyuh smoke weed?

Take lock up iymc

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Re: Official marijuana/marijuana legalization in TNT thread

Postby ruffneck_12 » April 21st, 2016, 2:47 pm

Best way to decriminalize it is to flood the justice system with cases.


Trinis lazy, it would be easier to decriminalize it than to process so much cases.

We must report ourselves and our friends, as well as any weed trees we happen to see. Just a thought.

DDoS.

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Re: Official marijuana/marijuana legalization in TNT thread

Postby X2 » April 22nd, 2016, 5:29 am

The justice system is already swamped with drug cases....while the real criminals go free with corruptly acquired contracts and millions in stolen government expenditure.

The sad fact is that drug rings ultimately enslave the low level dealers to believe that a gun and a few bucks in profit are better pay than a normal job... except it's not and has been proven to be a pyramid scheme to fatten the pockets of those higher up the chain while they starve the lower level sellers. The same story that people cry about 'big business' is copied by drug rings...de boss making all de money. The block boys will always be scrunters that feel a few gold chains, a tiida and sweet kicks are the epitome of life.... while they struggle to ever create any type of wealth... staying stupid and broke while faking the appearance of prosperity. Legalization will force some of the block boys into more socially unacceptable crime... and eventually death or jail. the rest of the poor souls may eventually get a clue and get a day job or an education.

The propaganda, law and legal system has so scarred our outlook on life that the general populace, even the weed dealers, actually believe that it is morally right to put people in jail for growing, transporting or selling a plant... the red herring... while politicians and lawyers rape our economy and destroy our ability to diversify... telling us that agriculture is a lost cause. Outlaw coffee and the sheep will bleat about it's devil-like effect on our energy levels... and stupid kids will start slinging it on the block... turning in their friends for a buck.

Men made up these laws to protect tobacco plantation money... Men decided to incarcerate their fellow man not on moral grounds... but for money and it didn't even come from our country... Americans... once again.... led the sheep to slaughter and laughing at the world for believing the BS.

We shouldn't ask for legalization... we should demand it.

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Re: Official marijuana/marijuana legalization in TNT thread

Postby DF1_2nR » May 2nd, 2016, 1:55 am

Progress.

Government has begun statistical groundwork for decriminalising of marijuana possession, says Attorney General Faris Al-Rawi. He told the T&T Guardian he is reviewing the Dangerous Drugs Act and wide consultation is planned before any policy decision is taken.

“There has been a full exercise of analysing the types of crime in our prisons and the pre-trials detention or remand statistics for a range of offences, including  possession of narcotics, and particlarly possession of cannabis. From that perspective there’s certainly a drive to gather statistical information,as the  issue of decriminalising of marijuana isn’t a simple one on the public  side,” the AG said.

“If one were to argue for decriminalisation, the limits to be applied must be considered. Does one wish to have a bus driver or teacher who’s in the course of  using narcotics, although decriminalised, on the job? That’s one set of societal factors to consider. On the other hand, is it right to engage in pre- trial detention in remand for two joints of marijuana  where your detention is by far longer than the conviction you can have?

“So obviously it involves proper consultation after gathering of  statistical information so that when the issue is brought to the public’s attention, it must be brought with facts, statistics, extrapolation on statistics, androecial  impact consideration as Trinidad and Tobago is a multi-dimensional society. There are, for instance, the views of religious bodies and  civil society groups that have to  be factored against any decision like this.”

Al-Rawi said Government is “obliged to take a very holistic approach to agitating the issue.” 

He explained: “We have to  consider it as it applies across the board, be it in the criminal justice system, in the social factors associated with people detained for narcotic use of a small quantity and the societal message you send to your young,  aged or your disadvantaged.

“So that kind of exercise is what we’re engaged in and we’ll certainly not shy away from issues but embrace then in a comprehensive, responsible fashion. After full consultation, a policy decision will be taken and the requisite  instruction to attenuate—reduce the force of—the laws or draft new laws, will then be taken.”

 Specifically confirming that Government has started the groundwork to decriminalise marijuana, the AG said: “Definitely the statistical approach being taken in the consultation on the prison analysis is one of those springboards into that venture,

“As an enabler of laws I must accept the views of several interest sectors. When one hears the judiciary, Caricom leaders, states that have gone that way and several sectoral interest groups speak to the need for  decriminalisation, those aren’t soft voices which haven’t thought about issues.”

Al-Rawi said it was important top think progressively we well as responsibly so thay laws are based on policy driven upon analysis with statistics, factual information and consultation.  

“So we’re gathering the statistical information. Very much so,” he said.

“And the exercise is being done and whatever the result, we’ll certainly engage with some transparency on the issue of analysis and also transparency of any advocacy that the government chooses after consultation on the position.”

 After that, he added, there will be a policy consideration. He agreed it cannot be an overnight process “because societal impact has to be considered,”

 Al Rawi said marijuana decriminalisation isn’t necessarily a novel thing since  T&T’s Customs law lists where duties are applied to import and export of ganja. He added that he isn’t ducking any issues.

The lobby to decriminalise marijuana has been gaining momentum in the last few years with various quarters, including the judiciary, bidding to free up security and other resources to deal with other pressing matters  Chief Justice  Ivor Archie alluded to the move when he addressed the opening of the 2013-2014 law term and Director of Public Prosecutions Roger Gaspard has supported decriminalisation..

Cautious responses on legalising ganja
Pro-decriminalisation quarters believe legalising marijuana can assist  T&T’s overburdened justice/security systems. The Caribbean Collective for Justice claims Caricom’s report on decriminalisation recommended a marijuana industry for medicinal purposes be developed selecting plants grown for cannabinoids; that the removal of incarceration as a penalty for marijuana possession be considered in light of the number of young people arrested for the offence regionally;  and that leaders “explore any commercial benefit from a potential multi-billion dollar industry including research, development and production of medicinal marijuana products.”

Reached for comment, Opposition MP Prakash Ramadhar, who held in the portfolio of Legal Affairs in the last PP administration said: “One has to be careful with this since not everyone is the same. I feel we cannot close our eyes to successes in the  medical marijuana aspect or use in treatment of some cancers or for pain but one has to be careful in experimenting. It may be beneficial for one, or harmful to another.”

President of the Law Association Reginald Armour said: “If the matter comes up, we’d certainly examine it...”

Colin Stephenson, who has been actively lobbying for decriminalisation of marijuana said he spoke with Al-Raw at the recent prison reform consultation and is “awaiting word on a proposed moratorium on arrests for possession of small quantities."


http://www.guardian.co.tt/news/2016-05-02/ag-reviewing-tt?s-drug-laws?utm_content=buffer53688&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer

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Re: Official marijuana/marijuana legalization in TNT thread

Postby desifemlove » May 2nd, 2016, 8:26 am

legalise it, export as a drug globally, and as hemp.

give people licences to grow/sell.

a disagree dat gangs will go postal... heroin transshipment and coke and even E are more profitable.

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Re: Official marijuana/marijuana legalization in TNT thread

Postby Miktay » May 2nd, 2016, 10:37 am

bluesclues wrote:Wit will just be another commodity legally traded in daylight business. The violent crime prestige it attracts is only because its illegal. When a man rob yuh rum shop, u don't call your mafia henchmen for him, u call d police. Yet once upon a time when alcohol was made illegal it gave rise to the mob. And yes yuh would get kill for tiefin rum from a mob seller. So case in point, legalize it, and it will no longer have a gang association because as it is now the majority ppl who have smoked marijuana or smoke, not in no gang.

U see they does have no choice. A man rob yuh block... u can't exactly go to the police and say someone thief yuh weed. Hence you have to mete out yuh own justice to get it back. Take away that need and ull also remove the cover block robbers use to rob men of their weed. But in the absence of any legal framework, the illegal trade will naturally structure a justice system to survive on.


True. Legalize it. Reduce the marginal propensity 4 violence.

Since justice sys doh really work 4 small bidnezz in T&T...let dem obtain legal firearms 2 protect their inventory.

legalise it, export as a drug globally, and as hemp.

give people licences to grow/sell.

a disagree dat gangs will go postal... heroin transshipment and coke and even E are more profitable
.

Thiz brought 2 us by Big Gubbament...

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Re: Official marijuana/marijuana legalization in TNT thread

Postby pete » May 2nd, 2016, 11:57 am

SMH..

“We have been in office for seven months and we spent no time examining the decriminalization of marijuana," Prime Minister Dr Keith Rowley stated on Monday morning, hours after a front page headline "AG looks at legal ganja,” set tongues wagging.
He was speaking at a news conference at Piarco International Airport, just before he departed T&T for a 12 day visit to Washington, New York, London and Ghana.
"I lead the cabinet and I don’t know that any such examination is taking place. I’ve seen the headline, I haven’t read the story but I’m pretty sure the Attorney General will really want to explain that and I would be very surprised if that is what he said,” the PM said in response to questions from reporters.
Attorney General Faris Al Rawi is quoted in the Trinidad Guardian as saying “There has been a full exercise of analyzing the type of crimes in our prisons and the pre-trial detention or remand statistics for a range of offense, including possession of narcotics and particularly possession of cannabis. From that perspective, there is certainly a drive to gather statistical information as the issue of decriminalization of marijuana, is not a simple one on the public’s side.”
On Monday morning, the AG stood by his comments: "There is a real consideration that our jails contain people with simple possession issues, marijuana in particular,” which he noted, is a live issue for the judiciary, the DPP and the AG’s office.”

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Re: Official marijuana/marijuana legalization in TNT thread

Postby De Dragon » May 2nd, 2016, 12:57 pm

pete wrote:SMH..

“We have been in office for seven months and we spent no time examining the decriminalization of marijuana," Prime Minister Dr Keith Rowley stated on Monday morning, hours after a front page headline "AG looks at legal ganja,” set tongues wagging.
He was speaking at a news conference at Piarco International Airport, just before he departed T&T for a 12 day visit to Washington, New York, London and Ghana.
"I lead the cabinet and I don’t know that any such examination is taking place. I’ve seen the headline, I haven’t read the story but I’m pretty sure the Attorney General will really want to explain that and I would be very surprised if that is what he said,” the PM said in response to questions from reporters.
Attorney General Faris Al Rawi is quoted in the Trinidad Guardian as saying “There has been a full exercise of analyzing the type of crimes in our prisons and the pre-trial detention or remand statistics for a range of offense, including possession of narcotics and particularly possession of cannabis. From that perspective, there is certainly a drive to gather statistical information as the issue of decriminalization of marijuana, is not a simple one on the public’s side.”
On Monday morning, the AG stood by his comments: "There is a real consideration that our jails contain people with simple possession issues, marijuana in particular,” which he noted, is a live issue for the judiciary, the DPP and the AG’s office.”

:lol: :lol:
Does this surprise you? Still have to admire Al-Rawi backpeddle/explanation

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Re: Official marijuana/marijuana legalization in TNT thread

Postby pete » May 2nd, 2016, 1:32 pm

It's a waste of the court's time to prosecute people for minor possession. Fully support Al-Rawi in this. Catch a guy with a couple grams of weed and we have to feed and house him for months/years, transport him to court, pay lawyers to prosecute him? Total BS and a waste of time. If anything it should incur a small fine as a deterrent, case closed.

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Re: Official marijuana/marijuana legalization in TNT thread

Postby De Dragon » May 2nd, 2016, 2:34 pm

pete wrote:It's a waste of the court's time to prosecute people for minor possession. Fully support Al-Rawi in this. Catch a guy with a couple grams of weed and we have to feed and house him for months/years, transport him to court, pay lawyers to prosecute him? Total BS and a waste of time. If anything it should incur a small fine as a deterrent, case closed.

Yes , but plenty of dem pipers go still make jail for ah joint because dem eh have money fuh no fine. What is there to support? Al-Rawi just trying for a soundbite, because Rowley say that ent even at the discussion stage, and as he loves to remind us, he is head of the Cabinet, so whenever he sees it fit to start the discussion he will.

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Re: Official marijuana/marijuana legalization in TNT thread

Postby pete » May 2nd, 2016, 3:00 pm

Like how many people make jail for not paying their traffic tickets?

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Re: RE: Re: Official marijuana/marijuana legalization in TNT thread

Postby bluesclues » May 3rd, 2016, 6:37 pm

pete wrote:It's a waste of the court's time to prosecute people for minor possession. Fully support Al-Rawi in this. Catch a guy with a couple grams of weed and we have to feed and house him for months/years, transport him to court, pay lawyers to prosecute him? Total BS and a waste of time. If anything it should incur a small fine as a deterrent, case closed.


Uni students get caught up in that.. productive societal contributors holding decent jobs not involved in crime also get caught up in that. Sure the judges giving plenty Bligh for the past year or a lil more with regards to possession cases. But the stigma implanted into older folks brains on marijuana usage is probably the most self righteous wickedness ever purported on society.

That these dumbasses actually feel like they 'helping' or 'doing you a favour' by sending you to jail for smoking marijuana. Or that they even assisting society by 'keeping the streets clean'.... is utter garbage. In marijuana's case at least.

Sorry but don't ever expect my support for legalizing cocaine/crack/meth/prescription drugs etc etc. We are talking, naturally growing, unprocessed, organic plant material. It's classification is wrong and needs to be ammended to prevent further societal 'complications', during these economic times.

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Re: Official marijuana/marijuana legalization in TNT thread

Postby desifemlove » May 4th, 2016, 10:15 am

DF1_2nR wrote:So your argument against legalization is that low level dealers will be out of business?

That's kind of the point. Eliminate the illegal market as much as possible and remove the strain on the police/judiciary/prison system that comes with enforcing the archaic laws.

Legalization alone isn't the answer. Legalization along with a realistic framework for regulation,cultivation, export/distribution locally as well as regionally of cannabis and hemp based products means lots of potential jobs being created. Who better to fill the positions than the persons that were illegally involved in the industry in the first place? It's a best case scenario sure, but if you have a chance to earn a legit living doing the same things you were doing illegally why continue with the riskier avenue?

There's lots of ground work to be done of course but the end state should be a sustainable industry that once managed competently brings in billions in revenue for the country if the examples we are seeing abroad are any indication.

If only we could get the backwards politicians/religious leaders etc. to see it that way, and eliminate the "weed is the devil" mindset brought on by years of propaganda, we have a chance at being an industry leader in the region. But more than likely they won't and we'll be stuck playing catch up after the fact.


how come people does compare T&T to how the USA is? in US, this may work. not in T&T wit high murder rate, small georgrpahical size, and gangs who does know people and can get to know people via hook or crook.... have you had a thoguht to why people does sell weed illegally?

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Re: Official marijuana/marijuana legalization in TNT thread

Postby djarc9 » June 10th, 2016, 9:58 am

Is anyone here against the decriminalization/legalization of Cannabis? If yes, I'd like to engage in a conversation as to why you believe it should remain illegal.

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Re: Official marijuana/marijuana legalization in TNT thread

Postby TrinbagoMan » April 20th, 2018, 10:11 pm


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Re: Official marijuana/marijuana legalization in TNT thread

Postby thefallengods » April 22nd, 2018, 4:48 am

all drugs should be legal.

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Re: Official marijuana/marijuana legalization in TNT thread

Postby TrinbagoMan » April 23rd, 2018, 10:13 am

thefallengods wrote:all drugs should be legal.


Agreed

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Marijuana For The 1% ONLY?

Postby bluefete » May 11th, 2018, 7:26 am

So in doing some research, I found this buried away in the Laws of Trinidad and Tobago -

The Dangerous Drugs Act - Act 38 of 1991 - Last Amended 2000 - Chapter 11:25 - pg. 12 ; Part II- POSSESSION OF AND TRAFFICKING IN DANGEROUS DRUGS - Section 4:


4. The Minister may, subject to Regulations made under
Section 57—



(b) issue licences for the cultivation, gathering or
production, at a stated place, of opium poppy,marijuana, or coca plant;



The Dangerous Drugs Act - Chapter 11:25 - pg. 35; PART IX MISCELLANEOUS -

57. (1) The Minister may make Regulations for carrying out the purposes and provisions of this Act and, without limiting the generality of the foregoing, may make Regulations—


(b) for the use, purchase, sale or possession of any dangerous drugs for medicinal or scientific purposes;


This looks like many years ago, the government realized that there was money to be made, and put things in place for the 1% to make a killing, when the time comes.

I certainly do not see the boys on the block getting any licenses to cultivate or produce marijuana for medicinal or scientific purposes.

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Re: Marijuana For The 1% ONLY?

Postby *KRONIK* » May 11th, 2018, 8:10 am

In....to cultivate, promote and sell

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