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Ketogenic Diet

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Shooter_boy_J
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Ketogenic Diet

Postby Shooter_boy_J » January 20th, 2017, 6:47 am

Has anyone ever tried the ketogenic diet? I really want to start it! Any advice or reasons why it isnt a good idea?

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Re: Ketogenic Diet

Postby pugboy » January 20th, 2017, 6:57 am

while you at it try a paleo diet and
for good measures one or two days a week only green smoothies
tell us if you feel better or worse

oh, start a high protein diet as well, that seems to be the current fad

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Re: Ketogenic Diet

Postby jl0908 » January 20th, 2017, 7:13 am

That thing works, high fats and protien. Try to maintain a calorie deficit as well

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Re: Ketogenic Diet

Postby maj. tom » January 20th, 2017, 7:28 am

Yes I can advise you medically (including detailed biochemistry if you are interested on how it works at that level) and on it and give you proper care and support to sustain the lifestyle. This is a real medical diet that can also be very dangerous if not applied correctly, so it'll do you well to skip the broscience section. It's also not fly-by-night or overnight stuff that you can just dive into, or you will fail. It's an entire lifestyle that involves every aspect of your life. Ketogenic adaptation takes many months which can be sustained indefinitely, and you'll start to understand diet as one of the core principles of medical health.

PM me. I'll get back to you and set up tutorial sessions.

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Re: Ketogenic Diet

Postby dogg » January 20th, 2017, 11:15 am

All weight-loss diets work if you follow the rules. They all work. All weight-loss diets work because they all are based on... reducing calorie intake. Its nothing magical. You can easily GAIN weight on a keto diet if you don't manage your calories.

Losing weight and keeping it off isn't about dieting, its about lifestyle change.

OP, how long can you go without eating hops, bake, roti, rice, desserts, chocolate, fruit? and myriad other goodies which are all forbidden by strict keto standards...

Do yourself a favour, forget flavour-of-the-month diets. Find a plan that will permanently work for you.
Practice portion control, reduce sugar intake. Eat more green or leafy vegetables, less starchy ones.
OR, try skipping a meal daily or alternately fast one day a week.

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Re: Ketogenic Diet

Postby X_Factor » January 20th, 2017, 3:47 pm

started it...went for 1mth and got the virus never bothered to restart because of the strictness and mental condition you need to adopt for it to really work....i started seeing some results after about 3 weeks but then i am not fat...could be water weight
amazon has keto strips to test to see the state of ketosis you are in
you will need that

i was using this one
https://www.amazon.com/Smackfat-Ketone- ... one+strips

depending on your lifestyle it may be easy or hard
bacon and fried eggs my main meals

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Re: Ketogenic Diet

Postby Miktay » January 20th, 2017, 4:11 pm

You can lose weight on this diet especially if you exercise.

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Re: Ketogenic Diet

Postby X_Factor » January 20th, 2017, 7:03 pm

^ thats the thing with this diet....i honestly think it isnt worth it...your body have to go through some serious changes and with the very low sugar and carb intake it will have you really sorta low energy/depressed state for some time untill your body adjusts to the new way of making energy and low carb diet
vibes in the gym was lack luster vs the zippy feeling you get when you are eating even a 3-500 cal deficit
when you go out food choices are so limited....i would have chicken burgers with bacon, pepper only and eat like half or less of the bun

i had more fun results just eating healthier and maintaining a 3- 500 cal deficit diet with weights and cardio
like oats and eggs in the morning vs doubles, some days i would still have one doubles instead of 2 kinda thing


but op, you can still go ahead, who knows your lifestyle and body may take to it very easy

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Re: Ketogenic Diet

Postby sMASH » January 20th, 2017, 11:06 pm

Did a kinda diet like that for a 2 months. Ate normal foods, except I stayed away from stuff with added sugar like sift drinks, pack juice, sweets, doughnut boys,, etc.
Stayed away from flour nearly as much, so roti and Dumplings were out. Breads were restricted to mornings
Cut down the added oils, but left the fats on meats.
Kept rice to about 2 to 4 times a week
Provisions to about the same.
I increased the amount of fruits as snacks, so instead of drinking a soft drink, had some water and fruits and nuts instead.

Mainly I ate beef steaks with steam or chunkay veg.
Sometimes I ordered talkarie with out the roti, and ate it with a spoon.


Although I didn't do additional exercise, at the time my job was physically demanding, and helped burn a lot.



I dropped at least 20 lb in 2 months.
Felt great, lots of energy, just wanted move all over .

But things came up and I could keep it up, and up to now I haven't settled back.


It isn't as strict as professionally designed diets, but it for did work, and when the weight started to drop in 2 weeks in, it dropped quickly, but I felt awesome.



All in all, I was inspired by naked and afraid. I devised it from thinking, what would people eat before any big technological advances in society... essentially a hunter gatherer diet.

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Re: Ketogenic Diet

Postby maj. tom » January 21st, 2017, 7:21 am

I hope you're taking note of the broscience OP. Don't be discouraged.

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Re: Ketogenic Diet

Postby jl0908 » January 21st, 2017, 7:32 am

I lost 20 lbs in 2 weeks as well. Somewhere in read your body turns into a fat burning machine lol

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Re: RE: Re: Ketogenic Diet

Postby jl0908 » January 21st, 2017, 7:33 am

jl0908 wrote:I lost 20 lbs in 2 weeks as well. Somewhere I read your body turns into a fat burning machine lol

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Re: Ketogenic Diet

Postby cherrypopper » January 21st, 2017, 7:37 am

Just now everyone in Trinidad will be thin.. running for your life burns a lot of calories.

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Re: Ketogenic Diet

Postby axe » January 22nd, 2017, 9:06 pm

just eat souse and cowheel soup every day and you orn!

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Re: Ketogenic Diet

Postby SNIPER 3000 » January 23rd, 2017, 1:41 pm

Way back in 2009 we did this diet for my daughter, who suffered from very chronic seizures.
The doctors here and dietitians did not know about it. It was very difficult to manage back then, we ordered the ketocal to do the diet because food stuff was difficult to find. Now there are stuff in most supermarkets, cream, sugar free snacks, coconut milks and oils, lots of diary subs. I remember we use to go to different supermarkets to buy out the sugar free wiping cream, now it's all over the place.

It's an amazing diet for many different reasons. It places your body in ketosis. I think we were one of the first few families that tried it in trinidad. It can do wonders for a lot of children suffering from seizures.
I could still remember the stupid doctors and trainees in Mt. hope hospital reaction when we told them about it. They laugh at us.

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Re: Ketogenic Diet

Postby maj. tom » January 23rd, 2017, 2:13 pm

yep, in fact it's been forgotten in modern medical teachings as a treatment of epilepsy since anticonvulsant drugs were invented in 1938 (Dilantin); the success rate with a correctly applied ketogenic diet (there are 4 types) was 83%, with 60% completely seizure free within 6 months. And then from 1977 with the demonization of eating fats, it was ridiculed. You can't even talk to doctors today about it. I'm glad that you found it and it's working for your child. Humans have known about this sort of diet/water fasting as a cure for epilepsy for 2000 years by the way.

There's been a recent renewal of research and application of the ketogenic diet ranging from epilepsy treatment to complete reversal of diabetes and the effects of insulin resistance. There are now ketogenic diet clinics in a number of countries; none in Trinidad of course. It's simply not taught at all in medical school anymore, despite the biochemistry of it being detailed in the courses of metabolism. (ketoacidosis vs. ketosis). Goes to show what students cram and what they learn to pass courses.

A very famous case study was Charlie Abrahams in 1993, the son of Director Jim Abrahams (Naked Gun, Police Squad, Airplane) suffered from terrible seizures as a 20 months old child and could not be cured by pharmacological drugs. No doctor, no neurologist that he went to offered any solution, never even heard about ketogenic diet. Jim found the literature himself in a medical library and applied it with review of a few specialist doctors, and within 4 days the seizures stopped and never returned. Quite remarkable in the face of modern drugs.

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Re: Ketogenic Diet

Postby j.o.e » January 23rd, 2017, 4:26 pm

It works. I've done it, effortless weight loss, better energy levels during the day, sharper mind. I was never overweight , like everyone I had a few lbs I could lose. Wasn't so much for weight loss as for overall health. I think that sugar/carb addiction is a real thing and wanted to get over it.

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Re: Ketogenic Diet

Postby SNIPER 3000 » January 24th, 2017, 1:32 pm

The young doctors are a waste....especially the female ones. They think epilim is the only drug for seizures and practice on the poor familes.

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Re: Ketogenic Diet

Postby goalpost » October 29th, 2019, 6:38 pm

Random story time:
I had reached 230lbs in April. What started me to try to lose weight was I did some blood tests & the nurse made me drink water to get my blood flowing. This scared me as I correlated "thick" blood to developing a blood clot (dont know if this is actually true). I also developed some really really bad snoring, to the point where my wife was very concerned.
Anyways started a diet in the beginning of May. Dont know if its really a diet, I just cut soft drinks (used to drink plenty Coke), changed my breakfast to oats, and eat more veggies or just home cooked food (macaroni pie, parboiled rice, some kind of beans and meat) in small to medium portions. Also black coffee. Eventually I started to jog which turned into some HIIT.
Dont misjudge the potency of HIIT in losing overall body fat.
I am now 160 lbs. I do think the HIIT was most beneficial overall, especially to my overall cardiovascular health. My snoring is completely gone, I breathe better . I am at a weight where I indulge in some sweet snacks ( I have 4 kids, its inevitable) here & there, but it's not something I need in my life.
I guess keto will work with someone but anyone looking to lose weight, there's only one thing to do : calorie deficit.
Of course eating 1000 cal of cupcakes will fcuk up ur guts and still mess with your sugar, so quality foods.
One of my go to places for good food was Ceasars.
Anyways end of story.

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Re: Ketogenic Diet

Postby Coppershot » October 29th, 2019, 9:27 pm

Google is your friend, Real Science over Bro Science

These sources are from a plant based nutrition site, but do your own research.
Pro tip, pause the videos and search for the research papers on https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed, most times they are free to read.




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Re: Ketogenic Diet

Postby Slartibartfast » October 30th, 2019, 12:30 pm

I did it for about 4 months back in 2016. It worked for me. I lost about 20 lbs. The first 2 weeks were by far the hardest but after that cravings kind of went away once I didn't let non-keto foods into my sight. I gave up after 4 months because the diet was too restrictive and difficult for me to maintain. Plus going keto means you have to give up alcohol to do it properly and I wanted to be able to have a few cold ones when I went out with friends.

But, the best thing about going keto was that it made intermittent fasting easier for me. Your body already accustomed burning fat for fuel so once you get over the hormone hunger triggers at meal time doing the intermittent fasting is a breeze. I lost about 35 pounds with the intermittent fasting and find that one much easier to stick to because I don't have to restrict what I eat, just when I eat it.

Btw, if you want to jump start your keto diet, consider doing a 2-day fast. Check out Dr. Jason Fung's youtube videos on fasting. By 2 days your body is already fully in a ketogenic state (don't have to worry about that 2 week period for it to kick it) and you can come off of your fast with something light like chicken soup and then continue with your keto diet from there.

The thing with any diet though is that you have to consider how long you can stick with it. The keto diet works but I put on all the weight and a little extra after I came off. I eventually gave into my cravings and eat pretty unhealthy for the year after that. The intermittent fasting worked better purely because I could stick with it indefinitely. I re-gained 5 lbs but kept off the other 30 lbs for the past 2 years with very little effort.

Building muscle on keto is easier though because you can eat more. Maintaining your body is easier with fasting because it is easier to remain consistent. If you are on the fence about it I would say do your research and give it a go.

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Re: Ketogenic Diet

Postby maj. tom » October 30th, 2019, 3:20 pm

Every single individual on this planet who has ever lived and procreated had different genetics. This means that not one diet can possibly fit all humans on this planet. Doctors will one day be able to take a DNA test and tailor a specific diet for each individual patient based on their genetic code.

Preaching keto or vegan or paleo or zerocarb or Standard American Diet for everyone is BS, because what works for A quite possibly would not work for B, C and G because of epigenetics that is very much influenced on lifestyles our parents lived and that we live. If your last 5 generations of ancestors were hunters in the Arctic living off seal meal and whale blubber all the time, it's 99% probable that you have inherited the genetics to live on zerocarb, while other people from another climate would suffer immensely from this. If you are a super athlete who has trained to perform off high carb all his life, then it's probable that your epigenetics, cellular respiration mechanisms and even gut microbiome has adapted in the short term to keep that level of performance and metabolic functions optimal for high carbs.

This is how you have some really brilliant scientists telling you about keto and others telling you about vegan because the research they did was focused on obtaining that outcome. Medical research is like that and there is no way we can say one diet is best for everyone. Some scientists are still sticking to their high carb, low fat guns ,though we definitely know that this is the wrong diet for the majority of every human population sample (caused by corrupt medical science research from the 1950s to early 2000s).

For example one of the misconceptions about keto is the general buzzfeed about fat and meats and losing weight rapidly, etc. But the purpose of keto is to fix your insulin resistance at a genetic level and correct the metabolic syndrome that affects most of the population caused by excess dietary sugar.

That one about alcohol is also not true. You can have alcohol on keto, just count them as empty calories that the body chooses to burn above any other energy molecule. And since your cells are now much more sensitive to alcohol for energy, rather than shunting it away through the liver and into fat cells and burning glucose instead, you realize that you are much more sensitive to the effects of alcohol. You have improved your insulin sensitivity on keto and thus lowered your alcohol tolerance. You have cleared a pathway in the metabolic syndrome minefield. Can't just drink one or two beers with friends? (Also consider that all alcohol is not the same. Wine is perhaps "healthier" than beer due to the organic complex cocktail of antioxidants formed in the fermenting process of fruits, while cheap vodka/rum/whiskey would probably be detrimental for your liver because of all the extra work it has to do to filter that poison and convert the excess energy into fat [ARLD]).

The bottom line is that diet is turning out to be much more complicated that all our collective knowledge so far and goes deeper to our genetic levels than just reading a few article or watching a YouTube video and decided that's the right way of life for you. This is confirmation bias. You look up things that what you want to be true to be given evidence that it is true, but you don't consider that it may be untrue as well for another population sample.

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Re: Ketogenic Diet

Postby Slartibartfast » October 30th, 2019, 3:56 pm

Good answer. WRT to alco, beer is cheap so that's what I normally go for and my thinking was that the carbs from ingesting the beer would throw off the keto diet. You are correct on diets being very individualistic though. It's about trying different things and seeing what works. I can say that keto definitely works and is worth at least trying.

I think the one thing that all nutritionists agree on is that fasting can be good for you. Just don't ask how often or for how long. That's where it all breaks down again :lol: Well to be more accurate I think the say occasionally being in a state of hunger can have potential health benefits.

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Re: Ketogenic Diet

Postby maj. tom » October 30th, 2019, 6:13 pm

No doubt about fasting. Cellular autophagy is a miracle mechanism that cells evolved over 2 billion years to survive. There's a reason why so many religions embraced and prescribe fasting as a way to clean the body and soul. Too bad we have all been programmed by cereal companies about breakfast being the most important meal of your day and you need sugar to function well in the classroom throughout the day. And 3 meals a day is something new, started somewhere around the Industrial Revolution in the 18th century. It is obvious that our ancestors faced very difficult famine times and if it were not for the mechanism of ketosis, none of us would be here today. I imagine that most times they would go a week... sometimes even a month in hard times... without catching any prey on the Africa Savannah and Urals, and foraging for wild roots could not sustain them for any length.

I have pulled several dozen 48 hour fasts when in deep ketosis. Eg. last meal Wednesday before 7pm, next meal Friday
7pm. Needless to say one meal a day is just the normal way of life everyday. You know there is medical literature that one should follow by Dr. Stephen Phinney when doing serious fasting, and it's important to get 5g Sodium per day as well as the Magnesium and Zinc to keep things optimal and motivated. This is where most people fail in fasting by not understanding the salt minerals and 1 gallon per day water requirements for life. This is why so many cultures drink animal blood after the hunt and eat the fresh steaming liver raw from a kill first (Eskimos, Masai come to mind). If you get severe headaches and nausea after 24 hours, it's just salt. I want to get up to 7 days someday. I read that's somewhat of a bliss point, kind of like the 7 days testosterone high from nofap.

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Re: Ketogenic Diet

Postby Slartibartfast » October 31st, 2019, 4:34 pm

I think you natural HGH also shoots up after like 5 days of fasting. Longest I ever did was 4 days and did a few 2 day fasts already. One meal a day really seems to be the sweet spot once you get accustomed to it. Pharmacies have hydration packets with sodium and potassium salts that helps. I use it once I cross 24 hours of fasting just as a precaution.

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