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Petrotrin refinery shut down

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De Dragon
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Re: Petrotrin refinery to shut down

Postby De Dragon » September 22nd, 2018, 1:32 pm

Trinispougla wrote:
shimon wrote:
The_Honourable wrote:Closure of the Refinery

The refinery has been ailing for a long time for well over 20 years or more. It is like a patient suffering from diabetes. He had a blister on one of his toes but ignored it. When it got progressively worse, only then he decided to see a doctor. The doctor took care of it and gave him some advice about his diet and precautions to be taken ie ( Consultants such as the Solomon’and Associates). He made little or no changes to his life style but gravitated back to the old habits. In fact he was given more sugary foods by his welfare adviser (the OWTU). Who wouldn’t like all that nice sweet delicious deserts. His condition got so serious that the entire body was infected. He got into a coma and was given life support. There was no chance of his survival as advised by medical experts, (International Consultants). His family and citizens and all concerned are now debating if they should pull the plug. The Governments of the past, the Board of Directors, OWTU and Management, all contributed to the current state of his condition.

Let us examine the data presented by the PETROTRIN board.:-

If PETROTRIN were to remain an integrated company and to be competitive, it would require $TT 25 billion to stay alive because the infrastructure needs to be refurbished as well as to pay it’s outstanding debts. Even if the above is done it will continue to lose $TT 2 billion a year.

Figures from the Government and PETROTRIN indicate that they lost $TT 8 billion in the last five years, is $TT12 billion in debt and owes the Government more than $TT3 billion in taxes and royalties.

The most modern refineries in the world with all the new technology are running at very low margines. Most of the older refineries in the world are shutting down because they are uncompetitive. Clean and renewable energy are advancing at a rapid rate, thus lowering the demand for crude oil.

Since in my days (1964-1999) of TEXACO now PETROTRIN, plants were being shut down because of obsolescence. For example, power stations A &B, Western Topping plants, No 2 Vacuum unit, Sulphur plant, Rexformer and Reformer units,,Dubbs cracking plant, Poly plant ,Nonene plant, old Acid plant, old Alkylation, uni,Lube oil plant, Normal Paraffin unit, Rerun unit and maybe others.The old Acid and Alky units have been replaced by new efficient units in keeping with new technology which was required.

The plants mentioned above were relevant in those days but because of changing market demands, product specifications and the need to improve efficiency, the company had to change strategy. But the workforce remained static with salaries and wages skyrocketing within the last decade creating a Dutch disease to the rest of the economy but also eroded the profitability of the company. The benchmark for a refinery producing 150,000 barrels per day elsewhere in the world employs a maximum of 50% less people than the Point-a-Pierre refinery. Admittedly, the Pointe-a-Pierre refinery with existing infrastructure is highly maintenance intensive.

PETROTRIN spends considerable amount of foreign exchange which they borrow to buy crude from the foreign market at market price, or may be at concessionary price. They have to blend PETRON’s high sulphur high gravity crude to make it suitable for processing. This refinery is perhaps the most inefficient refinery in the world that is still existing. After the crude is processed the bulk of the finished products have to be sold at competitive price in the open market. I can understand why the company is loosing $2 billion a year. The cost of refining a barrel of crude per capita of expense is far too high to make it commercially profitable. The worst part of it is that no bank will lend you money to buy crude when you are unable to pay your loan and service your interest payment. The Government says they are strapped for funds and they cannot help. Instead of being a net earner of foreign exchanger they are a net looser.

A survey done some years ago (Business Guardian) compared salaries of similar institutions in the US and other developed countries were slightly lower on the average compared to PETROTRIN using the equivalent $TT to $US. The situation is even worse today.

Because of the layout of the refinery, maintenance of piping alone contributes to high maintenance cost. There are enormous amount equipment that are old, such as electrical switch gears at the substations, About 50% of bad actors of rotating equipment are unreliable and contributing to plant downtime and frequent fires. Most of the pressure vessels on older plants are reaching retirement age due to corrosion. Relief valves have to be reset to accommodate loss of thickness in order to maintain marginal integrity. Storage tanks are falling a part, Tanks that are required for storage at present will require immediate maintenance. Utilities for air compressors steam generators and ancillary equipment are hanging on a string. All require considerable maintenance.

The above gives a grim picture in a nutshell of the mechanical condition of the refinery infrastructure that will require enormous capital expenditure to revamp and refurbishment to bring them back to an acceptable standard.
The company embarked on a Gasoline Optimization project that was a very good decision. The objective was to get a higher yield from a barrel of crude to produce higher value products and to minimize the heavy ends which is low in value.

The fiasco of this project was the inability to capitalize on the expected revenue because the project ran into severe cost overruns and very significant time delays.The revenue expected was supposed to pay for the bond of USD 850,000. The Cat Cracker, the bread and butter plant was shut down for almost two years. There is an integrity concern with the fractionator column that will require replacement shortly at a cost of $TT250 million. Heavy cracks were found and repaired but was given a lifeline for a few more years. Operators did not want to start up the plant after the upgrade.

The Gas to Liquid plant costing 2 billion dollars could not have been operated. The Ultra Low Sulphur Deisel plant was built without the correct code for earthquake. Lloyds will not insure it. Millions of dollars have already been spent and now millions more are required to rework the entire foundation. PETROTRIN is owing USD 750. Not one cent profit can be realized from the above projects. The interest to service the loan has been ongoing for the past three years and no indication when it will end.

The problem was the incompetent project managers and very incompetent and poor leadership of top managers and board of directors who did not recognize the consequences of keeping such a project costing billions of dollars on target and within cost. What was the purpose of the Board of Directors in collaboration with the Government? The stake holders are the citizens of the country and Governments past and present were elected to represent them. The oil industry,a multibillion dollar investment, is the flagship of the country and should be contributing the largest proportion of revenue to the government. It is turning out to be the biggest liability. . The responsibility of the government is to provide competent leadership and Management to ensure efficient performance of the company.. Every time a government changes the board of directors must also change. In most cases, the appointment of directors are based on political patronage rather than competence. It is the employees, taxpayers and the neighbourhood communities that will suffer the consequences. It is understandable why there is such an emotional impact.

It is very sad that a refinery that made valuable contribution to thousands of citizens and the economy for almost a century has to be shutdown. It is totally shameful.

PETROTRIN is now in a very deep hole and they don’t know how to get out of it They claim there is no other option but to shut down the refinery.

The situation is such that no one is being held accountable. This is typical of State run enterprises. Government should never get involved in owning and running State enterprises. Joint venture may work providing they are not the dominant shareholder. This is to avoid political interference. It must be run strictly as a sustainable commercial business entity rather than a welfare state company.

If the Board of Directors and the Government is correct in the data they presented,which I feel it is, their decision to shut the Refinery down is a good one.

I don’t think the socio economic fallout will impact very heavily. The 1700 permanent and 1500 temporary employees that are to be sent home will receive adequate compensation as promised by the government. The fallout may not be as bad if they seize the opportunity and use their innovative skills to explore other opportunities. The displaced employees which comprise less than 1 % of the population, even with salaries higher than the national average, may not adversely impact the overall economy. There may be a ripple effect for a short time but will normalize after adjustments have taken place.

The debate should now be the way forward. I have not yet seen any bright ideas coming from the population. We need some brainstorming.

This is my take on the closure of the refinery.

Rafeek Mohammed
Former Texaco and Petrotrin Engineering.



A well articulated piece.

indeed....fine use of metaphors........Petrotrin has been in trouble for decades. The revenues from hydrocarbons was just blinding people, Now tt has a gas shortage until we get dragon gas or shell makes a discovery, the corbeauxs have come home to roost and petrotrin needs to be addressed

Disgusting that money was not re-invested into the infrastructure of PT by ALL Governments. More disgusting is that GTL, ULSD were allowed to happen without any accountability ( Arse-Wari and JUHN Scarfy saw to that!). We have complexes like Yara/M1, which was built in the late 50's/early 80's still in operation because of upgrades, revamps, and other re-investments into the plant, so it can, and has been done.

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Re: Petrotrin refinery to shut down

Postby Allergic2BunnyEars » September 22nd, 2018, 1:36 pm

pete wrote:Was talk that they were going to be offered 2 months severance as per their collective agreement. So maybe slightly enhanced from that.
bess almera wrote:
Redman wrote:
sMASH wrote:When all those salaries come out of circulation u will see how much the people wasn't benefitting. That time it will be too late.


You act like all the employees will never ever look or find a job, not getting a lump sum,not getting a pension were allowed, and cant re tool and retrain or start something.

Quite a few Ive spoken to already have a plan in place and are cool with someone paying them a year worth of salary in front.


Most sensible post thus far. Payout package gonna be huge...wait for it.


Two months As per collective agreement? You sure about the collective agreement stating that?

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Re: Petrotrin refinery to shut down

Postby Redman » September 22nd, 2018, 1:38 pm

K_J_R wrote:
Redman wrote:
sMASH wrote:When all those salaries come out of circulation u will see how much the people wasn't benefitting. That time it will be too late.


You act like all the employees will never ever look or find a job, not getting a lump sum,not getting a pension were allowed, and cant re tool and retrain or start something.

Quite a few Ive spoken to already have a plan in place and are cool with someone paying them a year worth of salary in front.



dunno about lumpsum. there will be a payment but there is talk of bonds being used in payout. not sure how that works but if so ppl wont hive liquid cash

by law is two weeks for every year worked as severance i think


My understanding is that
1) Contributions paid over the term of employment plus interest.
2)1 month per year for the first 5 years and 1.25for the rest.

They figuring out how to deal with the allowances.

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Re: Petrotrin refinery to shut down

Postby jhonnieblue » September 22nd, 2018, 1:52 pm

De Dragon wrote:
Trinispougla wrote:
shimon wrote:
The_Honourable wrote:Closure of the Refinery

The refinery has been ailing for a long time for well over 20 years or more. It is like a patient suffering from diabetes. He had a blister on one of his toes but ignored it. When it got progressively worse, only then he decided to see a doctor. The doctor took care of it and gave him some advice about his diet and precautions to be taken ie ( Consultants such as the Solomon’and Associates). He made little or no changes to his life style but gravitated back to the old habits. In fact he was given more sugary foods by his welfare adviser (the OWTU). Who wouldn’t like all that nice sweet delicious deserts. His condition got so serious that the entire body was infected. He got into a coma and was given life support. There was no chance of his survival as advised by medical experts, (International Consultants). His family and citizens and all concerned are now debating if they should pull the plug. The Governments of the past, the Board of Directors, OWTU and Management, all contributed to the current state of his condition.

Let us examine the data presented by the PETROTRIN board.:-

If PETROTRIN were to remain an integrated company and to be competitive, it would require $TT 25 billion to stay alive because the infrastructure needs to be refurbished as well as to pay it’s outstanding debts. Even if the above is done it will continue to lose $TT 2 billion a year.

Figures from the Government and PETROTRIN indicate that they lost $TT 8 billion in the last five years, is $TT12 billion in debt and owes the Government more than $TT3 billion in taxes and royalties.

The most modern refineries in the world with all the new technology are running at very low margines. Most of the older refineries in the world are shutting down because they are uncompetitive. Clean and renewable energy are advancing at a rapid rate, thus lowering the demand for crude oil.

Since in my days (1964-1999) of TEXACO now PETROTRIN, plants were being shut down because of obsolescence. For example, power stations A &B, Western Topping plants, No 2 Vacuum unit, Sulphur plant, Rexformer and Reformer units,,Dubbs cracking plant, Poly plant ,Nonene plant, old Acid plant, old Alkylation, uni,Lube oil plant, Normal Paraffin unit, Rerun unit and maybe others.The old Acid and Alky units have been replaced by new efficient units in keeping with new technology which was required.

The plants mentioned above were relevant in those days but because of changing market demands, product specifications and the need to improve efficiency, the company had to change strategy. But the workforce remained static with salaries and wages skyrocketing within the last decade creating a Dutch disease to the rest of the economy but also eroded the profitability of the company. The benchmark for a refinery producing 150,000 barrels per day elsewhere in the world employs a maximum of 50% less people than the Point-a-Pierre refinery. Admittedly, the Pointe-a-Pierre refinery with existing infrastructure is highly maintenance intensive.

PETROTRIN spends considerable amount of foreign exchange which they borrow to buy crude from the foreign market at market price, or may be at concessionary price. They have to blend PETRON’s high sulphur high gravity crude to make it suitable for processing. This refinery is perhaps the most inefficient refinery in the world that is still existing. After the crude is processed the bulk of the finished products have to be sold at competitive price in the open market. I can understand why the company is loosing $2 billion a year. The cost of refining a barrel of crude per capita of expense is far too high to make it commercially profitable. The worst part of it is that no bank will lend you money to buy crude when you are unable to pay your loan and service your interest payment. The Government says they are strapped for funds and they cannot help. Instead of being a net earner of foreign exchanger they are a net looser.

A survey done some years ago (Business Guardian) compared salaries of similar institutions in the US and other developed countries were slightly lower on the average compared to PETROTRIN using the equivalent $TT to $US. The situation is even worse today.

Because of the layout of the refinery, maintenance of piping alone contributes to high maintenance cost. There are enormous amount equipment that are old, such as electrical switch gears at the substations, About 50% of bad actors of rotating equipment are unreliable and contributing to plant downtime and frequent fires. Most of the pressure vessels on older plants are reaching retirement age due to corrosion. Relief valves have to be reset to accommodate loss of thickness in order to maintain marginal integrity. Storage tanks are falling a part, Tanks that are required for storage at present will require immediate maintenance. Utilities for air compressors steam generators and ancillary equipment are hanging on a string. All require considerable maintenance.

The above gives a grim picture in a nutshell of the mechanical condition of the refinery infrastructure that will require enormous capital expenditure to revamp and refurbishment to bring them back to an acceptable standard.
The company embarked on a Gasoline Optimization project that was a very good decision. The objective was to get a higher yield from a barrel of crude to produce higher value products and to minimize the heavy ends which is low in value.

The fiasco of this project was the inability to capitalize on the expected revenue because the project ran into severe cost overruns and very significant time delays.The revenue expected was supposed to pay for the bond of USD 850,000. The Cat Cracker, the bread and butter plant was shut down for almost two years. There is an integrity concern with the fractionator column that will require replacement shortly at a cost of $TT250 million. Heavy cracks were found and repaired but was given a lifeline for a few more years. Operators did not want to start up the plant after the upgrade.

The Gas to Liquid plant costing 2 billion dollars could not have been operated. The Ultra Low Sulphur Deisel plant was built without the correct code for earthquake. Lloyds will not insure it. Millions of dollars have already been spent and now millions more are required to rework the entire foundation. PETROTRIN is owing USD 750. Not one cent profit can be realized from the above projects. The interest to service the loan has been ongoing for the past three years and no indication when it will end.

The problem was the incompetent project managers and very incompetent and poor leadership of top managers and board of directors who did not recognize the consequences of keeping such a project costing billions of dollars on target and within cost. What was the purpose of the Board of Directors in collaboration with the Government? The stake holders are the citizens of the country and Governments past and present were elected to represent them. The oil industry,a multibillion dollar investment, is the flagship of the country and should be contributing the largest proportion of revenue to the government. It is turning out to be the biggest liability. . The responsibility of the government is to provide competent leadership and Management to ensure efficient performance of the company.. Every time a government changes the board of directors must also change. In most cases, the appointment of directors are based on political patronage rather than competence. It is the employees, taxpayers and the neighbourhood communities that will suffer the consequences. It is understandable why there is such an emotional impact.

It is very sad that a refinery that made valuable contribution to thousands of citizens and the economy for almost a century has to be shutdown. It is totally shameful.

PETROTRIN is now in a very deep hole and they don’t know how to get out of it They claim there is no other option but to shut down the refinery.

The situation is such that no one is being held accountable. This is typical of State run enterprises. Government should never get involved in owning and running State enterprises. Joint venture may work providing they are not the dominant shareholder. This is to avoid political interference. It must be run strictly as a sustainable commercial business entity rather than a welfare state company.

If the Board of Directors and the Government is correct in the data they presented,which I feel it is, their decision to shut the Refinery down is a good one.

I don’t think the socio economic fallout will impact very heavily. The 1700 permanent and 1500 temporary employees that are to be sent home will receive adequate compensation as promised by the government. The fallout may not be as bad if they seize the opportunity and use their innovative skills to explore other opportunities. The displaced employees which comprise less than 1 % of the population, even with salaries higher than the national average, may not adversely impact the overall economy. There may be a ripple effect for a short time but will normalize after adjustments have taken place.

The debate should now be the way forward. I have not yet seen any bright ideas coming from the population. We need some brainstorming.

This is my take on the closure of the refinery.

Rafeek Mohammed
Former Texaco and Petrotrin Engineering.



A well articulated piece.

indeed....fine use of metaphors........Petrotrin has been in trouble for decades. The revenues from hydrocarbons was just blinding people, Now tt has a gas shortage until we get dragon gas or shell makes a discovery, the corbeauxs have come home to roost and petrotrin needs to be addressed

Disgusting that money was not re-invested into the infrastructure of PT by ALL Governments. More disgusting is that GTL, ULSD were allowed to happen without any accountability ( Arse-Wari and JUHN Scarfy saw to that!). We have complexes like Yara/M1, which was built in the late 50's/early 80's still in operation because of upgrades, revamps, and other re-investments into the plant, so it can, and has been done.
Actually Yara plant prob going to be shut down very soon, most inefficient ammonia plant on the island and m1 is carded to be mothballed as well

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Re: Petrotrin refinery to shut down

Postby De Dragon » September 22nd, 2018, 1:57 pm

jhonnieblue wrote:
De Dragon wrote:
Trinispougla wrote:
shimon wrote:
The_Honourable wrote:Closure of the Refinery

The refinery has been ailing for a long time for well over 20 years or more. It is like a patient suffering from diabetes. He had a blister on one of his toes but ignored it. When it got progressively worse, only then he decided to see a doctor. The doctor took care of it and gave him some advice about his diet and precautions to be taken ie ( Consultants such as the Solomon’and Associates). He made little or no changes to his life style but gravitated back to the old habits. In fact he was given more sugary foods by his welfare adviser (the OWTU). Who wouldn’t like all that nice sweet delicious deserts. His condition got so serious that the entire body was infected. He got into a coma and was given life support. There was no chance of his survival as advised by medical experts, (International Consultants). His family and citizens and all concerned are now debating if they should pull the plug. The Governments of the past, the Board of Directors, OWTU and Management, all contributed to the current state of his condition.

Let us examine the data presented by the PETROTRIN board.:-

If PETROTRIN were to remain an integrated company and to be competitive, it would require $TT 25 billion to stay alive because the infrastructure needs to be refurbished as well as to pay it’s outstanding debts. Even if the above is done it will continue to lose $TT 2 billion a year.

Figures from the Government and PETROTRIN indicate that they lost $TT 8 billion in the last five years, is $TT12 billion in debt and owes the Government more than $TT3 billion in taxes and royalties.

The most modern refineries in the world with all the new technology are running at very low margines. Most of the older refineries in the world are shutting down because they are uncompetitive. Clean and renewable energy are advancing at a rapid rate, thus lowering the demand for crude oil.

Since in my days (1964-1999) of TEXACO now PETROTRIN, plants were being shut down because of obsolescence. For example, power stations A &B, Western Topping plants, No 2 Vacuum unit, Sulphur plant, Rexformer and Reformer units,,Dubbs cracking plant, Poly plant ,Nonene plant, old Acid plant, old Alkylation, uni,Lube oil plant, Normal Paraffin unit, Rerun unit and maybe others.The old Acid and Alky units have been replaced by new efficient units in keeping with new technology which was required.

The plants mentioned above were relevant in those days but because of changing market demands, product specifications and the need to improve efficiency, the company had to change strategy. But the workforce remained static with salaries and wages skyrocketing within the last decade creating a Dutch disease to the rest of the economy but also eroded the profitability of the company. The benchmark for a refinery producing 150,000 barrels per day elsewhere in the world employs a maximum of 50% less people than the Point-a-Pierre refinery. Admittedly, the Pointe-a-Pierre refinery with existing infrastructure is highly maintenance intensive.

PETROTRIN spends considerable amount of foreign exchange which they borrow to buy crude from the foreign market at market price, or may be at concessionary price. They have to blend PETRON’s high sulphur high gravity crude to make it suitable for processing. This refinery is perhaps the most inefficient refinery in the world that is still existing. After the crude is processed the bulk of the finished products have to be sold at competitive price in the open market. I can understand why the company is loosing $2 billion a year. The cost of refining a barrel of crude per capita of expense is far too high to make it commercially profitable. The worst part of it is that no bank will lend you money to buy crude when you are unable to pay your loan and service your interest payment. The Government says they are strapped for funds and they cannot help. Instead of being a net earner of foreign exchanger they are a net looser.

A survey done some years ago (Business Guardian) compared salaries of similar institutions in the US and other developed countries were slightly lower on the average compared to PETROTRIN using the equivalent $TT to $US. The situation is even worse today.

Because of the layout of the refinery, maintenance of piping alone contributes to high maintenance cost. There are enormous amount equipment that are old, such as electrical switch gears at the substations, About 50% of bad actors of rotating equipment are unreliable and contributing to plant downtime and frequent fires. Most of the pressure vessels on older plants are reaching retirement age due to corrosion. Relief valves have to be reset to accommodate loss of thickness in order to maintain marginal integrity. Storage tanks are falling a part, Tanks that are required for storage at present will require immediate maintenance. Utilities for air compressors steam generators and ancillary equipment are hanging on a string. All require considerable maintenance.

The above gives a grim picture in a nutshell of the mechanical condition of the refinery infrastructure that will require enormous capital expenditure to revamp and refurbishment to bring them back to an acceptable standard.
The company embarked on a Gasoline Optimization project that was a very good decision. The objective was to get a higher yield from a barrel of crude to produce higher value products and to minimize the heavy ends which is low in value.

The fiasco of this project was the inability to capitalize on the expected revenue because the project ran into severe cost overruns and very significant time delays.The revenue expected was supposed to pay for the bond of USD 850,000. The Cat Cracker, the bread and butter plant was shut down for almost two years. There is an integrity concern with the fractionator column that will require replacement shortly at a cost of $TT250 million. Heavy cracks were found and repaired but was given a lifeline for a few more years. Operators did not want to start up the plant after the upgrade.

The Gas to Liquid plant costing 2 billion dollars could not have been operated. The Ultra Low Sulphur Deisel plant was built without the correct code for earthquake. Lloyds will not insure it. Millions of dollars have already been spent and now millions more are required to rework the entire foundation. PETROTRIN is owing USD 750. Not one cent profit can be realized from the above projects. The interest to service the loan has been ongoing for the past three years and no indication when it will end.

The problem was the incompetent project managers and very incompetent and poor leadership of top managers and board of directors who did not recognize the consequences of keeping such a project costing billions of dollars on target and within cost. What was the purpose of the Board of Directors in collaboration with the Government? The stake holders are the citizens of the country and Governments past and present were elected to represent them. The oil industry,a multibillion dollar investment, is the flagship of the country and should be contributing the largest proportion of revenue to the government. It is turning out to be the biggest liability. . The responsibility of the government is to provide competent leadership and Management to ensure efficient performance of the company.. Every time a government changes the board of directors must also change. In most cases, the appointment of directors are based on political patronage rather than competence. It is the employees, taxpayers and the neighbourhood communities that will suffer the consequences. It is understandable why there is such an emotional impact.

It is very sad that a refinery that made valuable contribution to thousands of citizens and the economy for almost a century has to be shutdown. It is totally shameful.

PETROTRIN is now in a very deep hole and they don’t know how to get out of it They claim there is no other option but to shut down the refinery.

The situation is such that no one is being held accountable. This is typical of State run enterprises. Government should never get involved in owning and running State enterprises. Joint venture may work providing they are not the dominant shareholder. This is to avoid political interference. It must be run strictly as a sustainable commercial business entity rather than a welfare state company.

If the Board of Directors and the Government is correct in the data they presented,which I feel it is, their decision to shut the Refinery down is a good one.

I don’t think the socio economic fallout will impact very heavily. The 1700 permanent and 1500 temporary employees that are to be sent home will receive adequate compensation as promised by the government. The fallout may not be as bad if they seize the opportunity and use their innovative skills to explore other opportunities. The displaced employees which comprise less than 1 % of the population, even with salaries higher than the national average, may not adversely impact the overall economy. There may be a ripple effect for a short time but will normalize after adjustments have taken place.

The debate should now be the way forward. I have not yet seen any bright ideas coming from the population. We need some brainstorming.

This is my take on the closure of the refinery.

Rafeek Mohammed
Former Texaco and Petrotrin Engineering.



A well articulated piece.

indeed....fine use of metaphors........Petrotrin has been in trouble for decades. The revenues from hydrocarbons was just blinding people, Now tt has a gas shortage until we get dragon gas or shell makes a discovery, the corbeauxs have come home to roost and petrotrin needs to be addressed

Disgusting that money was not re-invested into the infrastructure of PT by ALL Governments. More disgusting is that GTL, ULSD were allowed to happen without any accountability ( Arse-Wari and JUHN Scarfy saw to that!). We have complexes like Yara/M1, which was built in the late 50's/early 80's still in operation because of upgrades, revamps, and other re-investments into the plant, so it can, and has been done.
Actually Yara plant prob going to be shut down very soon, most inefficient ammonia plant on the island and m1 is carded to be mothballed as well

Yara is not a plant. Like M1 which is one plant in the methanol complex, plants in Yara that are less efficient, or produce less are taken offline primarily because of gas shortages. Nothing is wrong with M1, it is simply the lowest producer of all the plants.

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Re: Petrotrin refinery to shut down

Postby jhonnieblue » September 22nd, 2018, 2:10 pm

Yara is a a complex consisting of Yara, trinigen 1&2 so yes Yara is plant.

Capacity 992 STPD
Efficiency 40.82 mmbtu/St

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Re: Petrotrin refinery to shut down

Postby shimon » September 22nd, 2018, 7:29 pm

sinister_14 wrote:I wonder how all them petro workers feeling now... they voted for rowlair and he take away their jobs....but wait there is more...wasa...and t and tec next....the peenm has set this country on fire....i guess many of these people are sitting back and watching it burn....


Fear mongering just makes you look silly.

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Re: Petrotrin refinery to shut down

Postby sinister_14 » September 22nd, 2018, 9:37 pm

shimon wrote:
sinister_14 wrote:I wonder how all them petro workers feeling now... they voted for rowlair and he take away their jobs....but wait there is more...wasa...and t and tec next....the peenm has set this country on fire....i guess many of these people are sitting back and watching it burn....


Fear mongering just makes you look silly.
Are u brain dead shimon...or just outrageously stupid???

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Re: Petrotrin refinery to shut down

Postby The_Honourable » September 23rd, 2018, 12:55 am

Stop buying nonsense (from politicians)


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Re: Petrotrin refinery to shut down

Postby Redman » September 23rd, 2018, 3:52 am

Sounds great..the concept of a Caribbean injection.

Of course they have a history of talking big and not following through.

What's the history with their payments for UWI.?

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Re: Petrotrin refinery to shut down

Postby Allergic2BunnyEars » September 23rd, 2018, 7:03 am

Image

Image

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Re: Petrotrin refinery to shut down

Postby bluefete » September 23rd, 2018, 7:13 am

Man talking big but that project is in trouble.
Last edited by bluefete on September 23rd, 2018, 7:18 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Petrotrin refinery to shut down

Postby gastly369 » September 23rd, 2018, 7:15 am

SMH..

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Re: Petrotrin refinery to shut down

Postby Pointman-IA » September 23rd, 2018, 8:36 am

If Niquan Energy would be providing cleaner diesel, would they be selling it directly to NPMC and Unipet?

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Re: Petrotrin refinery to shut down

Postby Allergic2BunnyEars » September 23rd, 2018, 8:50 am

Pointman-IA wrote:If Niquan Energy would be providing cleaner diesel, would they be selling it directly to NPMC and Unipet?


Output for that plant is best suited for blending with lower quality diesel. Would be surprised if government imports low quality diesel just to supply Niquan with a market.

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Re: Petrotrin refinery to shut down

Postby Redman » September 23rd, 2018, 9:16 am

Pointman-IA wrote:If Niquan Energy would be providing cleaner diesel, would they be selling it directly to NPMC and Unipet?


Well the original plan was to blend up the output of the refinery so it qualifies for more markets.

Without that output.....at least for now they can sell it internationally.

Or run a premium line. Of diesel for the high end diesel vehicle s

I don't think that you can run ulsd just so...the low sulphur reduces lubricity I think.


Either way if you have volume you will have a buyer.

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Re: Petrotrin refinery to shut down

Postby Joshie23 » September 23rd, 2018, 9:26 am

The_Honourable wrote:Stop buying nonsense (from politicians)



Hard hitting points there. Again, magnitude is important but quite in Tobago, where the PM is from, schools are affected and road conditions are deplorable because of Petrotrin. I guess that's why their Chief Secretary had to use more of their taxpayer's money to buy the 7 Series, all while the THA is owing their own employees, because what name bad road in a Euro? 8-) They would have bought European and/or 4x4 vehicles for the entire population or fixed the road with the budget that was actually allocated to the Ministry of Works and Transport, but it was cheaper to blame Petrotrin on both counts. Meh. If Petrotrin is to blame for the nation's financial inefficiencies instead of the people put in charge of (not) distributing the resources appropriately, then I say firetruck the budget next Monday. Don't spend one red cent until Petrotrin is dissolved entirely and then (and only then) should we see our way financially I guess. Beds fuh so in the hospitals, no more potholes, water in pipes 24/7..first world status should be attained the day Petrotrin closes its doors.

Allergic2BunnyEars wrote:
Pointman-IA wrote:If Niquan Energy would be providing cleaner diesel, would they be selling it directly to NPMC and Unipet?


Output for that plant is best suited for blending with lower quality diesel. Would be surprised if government imports low quality diesel just to supply Niquan with a market.

You mean like..the diesel..we already produce? :(

I think much like an exponential curve on a graph, the boldfacedness of successive gov'ts never stabilizes but will always continue to tend to infinity. I am still in shock at the way the Gov't has been handling this situation, the vilification of some of their own citizens in the form of Petrotrin employees while others are vindicated, though they were part and parcel of the corruption, the disrespect and brashness demonstrated by the PM, Ministers of Energy and Finance, the board..it's unbecoming of any officeholder, but hey, the public gets what the public wants and the public wants the closure of Petrotrin. Great is the PNM; catering to the needs of the(ir) people.

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Re: Petrotrin refinery to shut down

Postby Pointman-IA » September 23rd, 2018, 9:38 am

The new watchwords for this twin island state should be-
One Percent.
Corruption.
Deception



Pointman-IA was last seen under the K4M Engine, waiting patiently for a red or yellow jersey to wipe the dip stick.

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Re: Petrotrin refinery to shut down

Postby shimon » September 23rd, 2018, 9:59 am

sinister_14 wrote:
shimon wrote:
sinister_14 wrote:I wonder how all them petro workers feeling now... they voted for rowlair and he take away their jobs....but wait there is more...wasa...and t and tec next....the peenm has set this country on fire....i guess many of these people are sitting back and watching it burn....


Fear mongering just makes you look silly.
Are u brain dead shimon...or just outrageously stupid???


According to you the Peenm and Rowlair after studying the data, consulting with experts, and countless other sustainability studies have concluded to willingly shut down a profitable state enterprise to destabilize this country and other Caricom neighbors because Rowlair and the Peenm just want to watch this country burn and resort to anarchy and chaos? brain dead or outrageously stupid? can I get a third option?

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Re: Petrotrin refinery to shut down

Postby Allergic2BunnyEars » September 23rd, 2018, 10:04 am

Image

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Re: Petrotrin refinery to shut down

Postby De Dragon » September 23rd, 2018, 11:04 am

jhonnieblue wrote:Yara is a a complex consisting of Yara, trinigen 1&2 so yes Yara is plant.

Capacity 992 STPD
Efficiency 40.82 mmbtu/St

You look like one of those people who say "methanol" when they are referring to any one of the Plants in the MX Complex :lol: :lol:
40.82? You sure about that figure?

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Re: Petrotrin refinery to shut down

Postby gastly369 » September 23rd, 2018, 1:10 pm

.
42426827_1448897511921889_1931547595893637120_o.png.jpeg

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Re: Petrotrin refinery to shut down

Postby sMASH » September 23rd, 2018, 1:12 pm

Allergic2BunnyEars wrote:Image

Image
I remember dat, it was incomplete..

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Re: Petrotrin refinery to shut down

Postby bluefete » September 23rd, 2018, 2:21 pm

gastly369 wrote:.42426827_1448897511921889_1931547595893637120_o.png.jpeg



Unallocated corporate items - A PROFIT of $70.2 million?????????????

AND

That $67.4 million reversal from the WGTL project???????

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Re: Petrotrin refinery to shut down

Postby The_Honourable » September 23rd, 2018, 8:20 pm

sMASH wrote:


Web of Deception... good video.

Allison Lewis moving suspect within the public service.

(Watch from 6th minute)

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Re: Petrotrin refinery to shut down

Postby matr1x » September 23rd, 2018, 8:33 pm

Petro-swindle

Petro-skull
Petro-reo
Petro- oh no, Marlene ate the rest...

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Re: Petrotrin refinery to shut down

Postby Pointman-IA » September 23rd, 2018, 8:36 pm

Petro-rruption

Petro-fusion

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Re: Petrotrin refinery to shut down

Postby kstt » September 23rd, 2018, 9:17 pm

PetroChin

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Re: Petrotrin refinery to shut down

Postby vaiostation » September 23rd, 2018, 10:00 pm

Petro-Aboud-Sabga

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Re: Petrotrin refinery to shut down

Postby Pointman-IA » September 23rd, 2018, 10:44 pm

Petro-tuner

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