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Basdeo Panday: “The PNM will Win the next General Election” ...

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Re: Basdeo Panday: “The PNM will Win the next General Election” ...

Postby hydroep » December 10th, 2019, 6:53 am

The results of the LGE showed that nothing's for certain but the PNM probably has the edge for the GE because of the demographic makeup of the constituencies. Thing is: would their winning again be such a bad thing?

A storm is coming.

The PNM has a documented history of messing things up and then leaving other people with the unpopular job of cleaning up their mess. The NAR bore the brunt of the public's ire back in the late 80s when they were forced to make the structural adjustments necessary to stabilise the economy and that brought out the worst elements of our society with the Jamaat's attempted coup in 1990.

Sure, on paper things aren't as bad now as they were in the 80s BUT there seems to be a lot more discontent on the ground because the disenfranchised middle and lower classes are probably much larger now.

IMO the PNM has never had to evolve because they've never had to face the consequences of their actions. That needs to change so let them go back and face the music.

At the very least all the people that put them there will continue to remain quiet while Growlers & Co. f#cks the country into oblivion. As they say: "silence is golden"...:|

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Re: Basdeo Panday: “The PNM will Win the next General Election” ...

Postby zoom rader » December 10th, 2019, 7:39 am

hydroep wrote:The results of the LGE showed that nothing's for certain but the PNM probably has the edge for the GE because of the demographic makeup of the constituencies. Thing is: would their winning again be such a bad thing?

A storm is coming.

The PNM has a documented history of messing things up and then leaving other people with the unpopular job of cleaning up their mess. The NAR bore the brunt of the public's ire back in the late 80s when they were forced to make the structural adjustments necessary to stabilise the economy and that brought out the worst elements of our society with the Jamaat's attempted coup in 1990.

Sure, on paper things aren't as bad now as they were in the 80s BUT there seems to be a lot more discontent on the ground because the disenfranchised middle and lower classes are probably much larger now.

IMO the PNM has never had to evolve because they've never had to face the consequences of their actions. That needs to change so let them go back and face the music.

At the very least all the people that put them there will continue to remain quiet while Growlers & Co. f#cks the country into oblivion. As they say: "silence is golden"...:|


The people that remain quiet are the ones who milk the system and could not careless about normal people nor country , once their pockets are filling that's all that's matters.

These are the people that will catch and sell African to the slavers .

They are first to say that they are sufferer

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Re: Basdeo Panday: “The PNM will Win the next General Election” ...

Postby Dizzy28 » December 10th, 2019, 9:47 am

Kamla and the UNC has the opportunity now to grab Rowley and the PNM by the balls and comfortably win the GE next year however they really still don't seem to want to win.
Maybe they are intimidated by a possibility they will actually have to govern with no money.

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Re: Basdeo Panday: “The PNM will Win the next General Election” ...

Postby Blaze d Chalice » December 10th, 2019, 10:05 am

Even if UNC win, it wouldn't last for long.

You feel is grocery and parlor Quamie dem planning to rob with the type and quantity of firepower dem bringing in in Diego and Point?

PNM have the next 5 years lock whether it is by fair means or not.

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Re: Basdeo Panday: “The PNM will Win the next General Election” ...

Postby Ben_spanna » December 10th, 2019, 10:11 am

Nails in the coffin going in right about now!

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Re: Basdeo Panday: “The PNM will Win the next General Election” ...

Postby Rovin » December 10th, 2019, 10:44 am

d marginals is what always win d elections in this country so unc needs to focus almost solely on this , start buttering up d ppl there early & heavily

watson duke also needs to do this for dem 2 tobago seats

all d other areas is die hard pnm\unc as was proven jes last wk ....

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Re: Basdeo Panday: “The PNM will Win the next General Election” ...

Postby matr1x » December 10th, 2019, 10:48 am

Pnm not bright enough to change their minds

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Re: Basdeo Panday: “The PNM will Win the next General Election” ...

Postby shake d livin wake d dead » December 10th, 2019, 10:48 am

if the PNM does win, I interested in seeing if shitlickers still gonna blame the UNC from 2010-2015 and not mention what ever took place from 15-20

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Re: Basdeo Panday: “The PNM will Win the next General Election” ...

Postby Rovin » December 10th, 2019, 11:01 am

^^buh u asking answers , no doubt he gonna keep blaming kamla ...

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Re: Basdeo Panday: “The PNM will Win the next General Election” ...

Postby l33t2 » December 10th, 2019, 1:36 pm

Rovin wrote:d marginals is what always win d elections in this country so unc needs to focus almost solely on this , start buttering up d ppl there early & heavily

watson duke also needs to do this for dem 2 tobago seats

all d other areas is die hard pnm\unc as was proven jes last wk ....


Moruga Tableland, Sangre Grande, La Horquetta Talparo and St Joseph going back UNC.

That's 21 seats, not even counting tunapuna or Sando West (the hate for Faris is ripe there).

If PNM manage to turn this around (unlikely) they'll win 21-20. Best case for UNC is 23-18

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Re: Basdeo Panday: “The PNM will Win the next General Election” ...

Postby D Diesel Report » December 10th, 2019, 2:53 pm

l33t2 wrote:
Rovin wrote:d marginals is what always win d elections in this country so unc needs to focus almost solely on this , start buttering up d ppl there early & heavily

watson duke also needs to do this for dem 2 tobago seats

all d other areas is die hard pnm\unc as was proven jes last wk ....


Moruga Tableland, Sangre Grande, La Horquetta Talparo and St Joseph going back UNC.

That's 21 seats, not even counting tunapuna or Sando West (the hate for Faris is ripe there).

If PNM manage to turn this around (unlikely) they'll win 21-20. Best case for UNC is 23-18


Yuh Fugget d Two Tobago seats and D'abadie Omera.

Das 26 non PNM seats. :drinking: :drinking:

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Re: Basdeo Panday: “The PNM will Win the next General Election” ...

Postby Ben_spanna » December 10th, 2019, 3:06 pm

Yellow or RED, both do the same thing, both promising things and when they get into power they couldnt care less for their general voters...
We need new blood in the political race, we need a neutral party that actually cares about the future of the country and wont go blaming the previous parties for the current state of the country.
Question is can you honestly see a Non Indian or Non-Afro Trinidadian winning the election with no proven history ?
Do you think people will ever get smart and not vote for their previous parties due to them being treated like crap and left by the way side?

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Re: Basdeo Panday: “The PNM will Win the next General Election” ...

Postby shake d livin wake d dead » December 10th, 2019, 3:18 pm

l33t2 wrote:
Rovin wrote:d marginals is what always win d elections in this country so unc needs to focus almost solely on this , start buttering up d ppl there early & heavily

watson duke also needs to do this for dem 2 tobago seats

all d other areas is die hard pnm\unc as was proven jes last wk ....


Moruga Tableland, Sangre Grande, La Horquetta Talparo and St Joseph going back UNC.

That's 21 seats, not even counting tunapuna or Sando West (the hate for Faris is ripe there).

If PNM manage to turn this around (unlikely) they'll win 21-20. Best case for UNC is 23-18


you real hopeful

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Re: Basdeo Panday: “The PNM will Win the next General Election” ...

Postby l33t2 » December 10th, 2019, 3:34 pm

Ben_spanna wrote:Yellow or RED, both do the same thing, both promising things and when they get into power they couldnt care less for their general voters...
We need new blood in the political race, we need a neutral party that actually cares about the future of the country and wont go blaming the previous parties for the current state of the country.
Question is can you honestly see a Non Indian or Non-Afro Trinidadian winning the election with no proven history ?
Do you think people will ever get smart and not vote for their previous parties due to them being treated like crap and left by the way side?


This is a typical misconception that they're both equally bad.

Regardless of what you think, the evidence speaks for itself. When UNC is in power, things improve far more quickly than PNM (they were never this bad under Manning tbh though).

UNC acts almost like a populist government, catering to ppl's demands often too much, but generally the demands of the ppl were never too unreasonable.

PNM has spent almost as much money (if not more) in 4 years vs. what PP spent in 5, even when factoring inflation.

They both 'thief' that is a common symptom of any democracy. In Trinidad though, there are too little checks and balances to prevent the nepotism.

Where they differ in corruption is that PNM will thief by awarding contracts, or manipulating the economy so that their financers benefit. Their financers are the old money of Trinidad and Tobago. Don't forget we are a former colony, who owned the country and its wealth prior to 1962? The English, which then gave way to the Syrians and then in the last 30 years, the Indos to much lesser extent.

There is only so much money in TT, and the fight over who controls it is between the financers or both parties. Don't forget though, both parties bend over backwards to those rich enough and those playing both sides.

That said, when in power, despite some questionable appointments and contracts awarded to those clearly unqualified (but still legal, go over the paper work and see). UNC is a performing government, simply due to the fact that they don't live in the trinidad 'west' bubble.

Vote with logic, we don't have this miracle 3rd party. Almost no country does, and if they exist they'll never win. What we need to do is keeping voting for the lesser of two evils until, they become a tolerable evil over time.

By voting in PNM again, we are simply giving condoning their power and control which is quickly wrecking Trinidad.

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Re: Basdeo Panday: “The PNM will Win the next General Election” ...

Postby Slartibartfast » December 10th, 2019, 4:36 pm

l33t2 wrote:Vote with logic, we don't have this miracle 3rd party. Almost no country does, and if they exist they'll never win. What we need to do is keeping voting for the lesser of two evils until, they become a tolerable evil over time.

Don't do this. This rewards non-performance. This is the reason why we are in this position. PNM was voted in because they were thought to be the "lesser of 2 evils" in 2015 and UNC was voted in for the same reason in 2010.

You touched on the truth and some of your thinking is on the right track though. Let me break it down into point form and let me know if you think it makes sense.
l33t2 wrote: Don't forget though, both parties bend over backwards to those rich enough and those playing both sides.
- Here you imply that those "rich enough" are the ones that have the real power. Let's call them the "oligarchs".
- To them it doesn't matter whether PNM or UNC is in power, because they get played the same way.
- From the point of view of the oligarchs, the last thing they want is a third party coming into power and ignoring the rules of engagement

Now because your statement implies that they see UNC/PNM as one entity, let's look at their behaviour and see if what you say makes any sense.

- PNM has been in power for 4 years so far. They have constantly alleged rampant corruption under the UNC. They have also have strong supporters that they consider close to their heart. Who (between the UNC and the PNM supporters) have suffered more in that last 4 years? How many investigations into UNC projects have been commenced and how many politicians saw the inside of a jail?

- UNC was in power for 5 years before that. There were several reports done into corruption in the PNM (Uff report, Bernard Report). They were handed several smoking guns for their opposition on a silver platter. What did they do with it? How many reports progressed into investigations? How many politicians saw the inside of a jail? Let's not forget about Section 34.

in 2010 we voted out PNM. In 2015 we voted out UNC. Now, by voting the lesser of 2 evils, you want to vote out PNM again? But we tried that 10 years ago and it didn't work. The winning party normally gets about 35% of the voting population's votes. There is typically about 30% of the voting population's votes that goes neither to UNC or PNM.

Instead of voting for the lesser of two evils we need to try to get any many people out there to vote next year as possible. Vote for third parties, spoil your ballot. Do anything else but don't abstain and don't vote for the"lesser of two evils".

The problem is that we don't have a viable third party to battle against UNM/PNC (a.k.a. the orange party). Voting for the lesser of two evils is just a way to stick our heads in the sand and hope they find it in their hearts to stop f^&*ing us over in the next 5 years. If they don't what do we plan to do then? Vote back in PNM? How else will a third party ever become viable if we never vote for it.

TL:DR Encourage people to come out and vote for third parties next year. It will give these other parties some viability and increase our political options in the 2025 elections. It's time that we as a people start thinking long term strategy as well, because our politicians are not going to do it for us.

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Re: Basdeo Panday: “The PNM will Win the next General Election” ...

Postby l33t2 » December 10th, 2019, 5:34 pm

Slartibartfast wrote:
l33t2 wrote:Vote with logic, we don't have this miracle 3rd party. Almost no country does, and if they exist they'll never win. What we need to do is keeping voting for the lesser of two evils until, they become a tolerable evil over time.

Don't do this. This rewards non-performance. This is the reason why we are in this position. PNM was voted in because they were thought to be the "lesser of 2 evils" in 2015 and UNC was voted in for the same reason in 2010.

You touched on the truth and some of your thinking is on the right track though. Let me break it down into point form and let me know if you think it makes sense.
l33t2 wrote: Don't forget though, both parties bend over backwards to those rich enough and those playing both sides.
- Here you imply that those "rich enough" are the ones that have the real power. Let's call them the "oligarchs".
- To them it doesn't matter whether PNM or UNC is in power, because they get played the same way.
- From the point of view of the oligarchs, the last thing they want is a third party coming into power and ignoring the rules of engagement

Now because your statement implies that they see UNC/PNM as one entity, let's look at their behaviour and see if what you say makes any sense.

- PNM has been in power for 4 years so far. They have constantly alleged rampant corruption under the UNC. They have also have strong supporters that they consider close to their heart. Who (between the UNC and the PNM supporters) have suffered more in that last 4 years? How many investigations into UNC projects have been commenced and how many politicians saw the inside of a jail?

- UNC was in power for 5 years before that. There were several reports done into corruption in the PNM (Uff report, Bernard Report). They were handed several smoking guns for their opposition on a silver platter. What did they do with it? How many reports progressed into investigations? How many politicians saw the inside of a jail? Let's not forget about Section 34.

in 2010 we voted out PNM. In 2015 we voted out UNC. Now, by voting the lesser of 2 evils, you want to vote out PNM again? But we tried that 10 years ago and it didn't work. The winning party normally gets about 35% of the voting population's votes. There is typically about 30% of the voting population's votes that goes neither to UNC or PNM.

Instead of voting for the lesser of two evils we need to try to get any many people out there to vote next year as possible. Vote for third parties, spoil your ballot. Do anything else but don't abstain and don't vote for the"lesser of two evils".

The problem is that we don't have a viable third party to battle against UNM/PNC (a.k.a. the orange party). Voting for the lesser of two evils is just a way to stick our heads in the sand and hope they find it in their hearts to stop f^&*ing us over in the next 5 years. If they don't what do we plan to do then? Vote back in PNM? How else will a third party ever become viable if we never vote for it.

TL:DR Encourage people to come out and vote for third parties next year. It will give these other parties some viability and increase our political options in the 2025 elections. It's time that we as a people start thinking long term strategy as well, because our politicians are not going to do it for us.


Your head in the right place but it's unrealistic, COP had the best momentum ever for a 3rd party and they did not win a seat. A 3rd party to succeedimg5 is extremely unlikely. And guess what? You'll end up with another 'corrupt' party after 5 years, just human nature especially here in tnt

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Re: Basdeo Panday: “The PNM will Win the next General Election” ...

Postby Redress10 » December 10th, 2019, 6:11 pm

T33ts

Unc would be viable if they were not only interested in enriching their tribal base and friends and financiers. We get a lot of projects but that is simply to divert public funds to enrich friends.

Last time PNM had massive contracts was Manning and the waterfront. Our problem is parties using billions of dollars to create white elephants just to get financiers rich.

The reality is the oligarchs don't choose sides. They play the country. They don't care about the development of the country. We need people who put development ahead of everything else.

Racial politics is trinidad is manufactured for monetary gain by the few. Even PNM and UNC are pawns.

How many years we living in TnT and can anyone of you say you ever see a local white who is a soldier/police/fireman or public servant? What about a cerian in one of those positions? So obviously those people have had an alternate economy for the past 50 something odd years that sustain their communities. In short, the control the majority of the economy but they are a numerical minority of maybe less than 15000 people.

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Re: Basdeo Panday: “The PNM will Win the next General Election” ...

Postby Redress10 » December 10th, 2019, 6:13 pm

I also don't agree that a non indo or afro should be our PM. Our gov't needs to reflect the need and realities of country. A non indo or afro wouldn't be able to relate to the majority races of the island so why should they lead them?

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Re: Basdeo Panday: “The PNM will Win the next General Election” ...

Postby eliteauto » December 10th, 2019, 6:24 pm

Redress10 wrote:I also don't agree that a non indo or afro should be our PM. Our gov't needs to reflect the need and realities of country. A non indo or afro wouldn't be able to relate to the majority races of the island so why should they lead them?
You do know some citizens regard themselves as Trinidadians and Tobagonians right?

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Re: Basdeo Panday: “The PNM will Win the next General Election” ...

Postby Redress10 » December 10th, 2019, 6:34 pm

eliteauto wrote:
Redress10 wrote:I also don't agree that a non indo or afro should be our PM. Our gov't needs to reflect the need and realities of country. A non indo or afro wouldn't be able to relate to the majority races of the island so why should they lead them?
You do know some citizens regard themselves as Trinidadians and Tobagonians right?


Bro, realistically those people in the minority now. We need to start being realistic. Which is why I say we need people who are strictly focused on nation development.

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Re: Basdeo Panday: “The PNM will Win the next General Election” ...

Postby zoom rader » December 10th, 2019, 7:19 pm

Redress10 wrote:I also don't agree that a non indo or afro should be our PM. Our gov't needs to reflect the need and realities of country. A non indo or afro wouldn't be able to relate to the majority races of the island so why should they lead them?
Bro 1% running/stealing this country.

Rowlee is just window dressing

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Re: Basdeo Panday: “The PNM will Win the next General Election” ...

Postby Slartibartfast » December 11th, 2019, 8:37 am

l33t2 wrote:Your head in the right place but it's unrealistic, COP had the best momentum ever for a 3rd party and they did not win a seat. A 3rd party to succeedimg5 is extremely unlikely. And guess what? You'll end up with another 'corrupt' party after 5 years, just human nature especially here in tnt
That is because they hesitated and allowed themselves to be swallowed by the UNC. If they remained independent they would could have been a viable third party now. I think everybody's problem in this country is that we do not think long term.

Following your logic, do you think that UNC and PNM will last for the next 50 years, 100 years, 500 years, 1000 years? It's common knowledge that nothing lasts forever, so why treat the orange party like they are going to?

Also, how else do you expect change to start? They will meet their end somewhere and at sometime. This is how change starts. With one person, taking one action to start on a non-viable solution until it builds into something viable.

Voting the "lesser of two evils" just delays this change for the better so that we can continue down the same path that has been failing is for the last 10 years.

Again, I agree with you btw. You are correct when you say that a 3rd part succeeding is extemely unlikely. In fact I will say it is impossible for one to succeed in 2020, 5% chance for success in 2025 and maybe a 15% chance of success in 2030 if we stop voting for the lesser of two evils now. But if we continue, we just delay the inevitable. The PNM and UNC will end because all things that exist come to an end. The question is, how do you want it to end. In your control with some chance at a better future or when our economy just cant handle the poor leadership anymore and we end up like Venezuela.

Redress10 wrote:I also don't agree that a non indo or afro should be our PM. Our gov't needs to reflect the need and realities of country. A non indo or afro wouldn't be able to relate to the majority races of the island so why should they lead them?
This is racist, but worse than that, it's just a poor argument. Why can't a non indo or afro relate to the races of the island?

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Re: Basdeo Panday: “The PNM will Win the next General Election” ...

Postby zoom rader » December 11th, 2019, 9:32 am

Slartibartfast wrote:
l33t2 wrote:Your head in the right place but it's unrealistic, COP had the best momentum ever for a 3rd party and they did not win a seat. A 3rd party to succeedimg5 is extremely unlikely. And guess what? You'll end up with another 'corrupt' party after 5 years, just human nature especially here in tnt
That is because they hesitated and allowed themselves to be swallowed by the UNC. If they remained independent they would could have been a viable third party now. I think everybody's problem in this country is that we do not think long term.

Following your logic, do you think that UNC and PNM will last for the next 50 years, 100 years, 500 years, 1000 years? It's common knowledge that nothing lasts forever, so why treat the orange party like they are going to?

Also, how else do you expect change to start? They will meet their end somewhere and at sometime. This is how change starts. With one person, taking one action to start on a non-viable solution until it builds into something viable.

Voting the "lesser of two evils" just delays this change for the better so that we can continue down the same path that has been failing is for the last 10 years.

Again, I agree with you btw. You are correct when you say that a 3rd part succeeding is extemely unlikely. In fact I will say it is impossible for one to succeed in 2020, 5% chance for success in 2025 and maybe a 15% chance of success in 2030 if we stop voting for the lesser of two evils now. But if we continue, we just delay the inevitable. The PNM and UNC will end because all things that exist come to an end. The question is, how do you want it to end. In your control with some chance at a better future or when our economy just cant handle the poor leadership anymore and we end up like Venezuela.

Redress10 wrote:I also don't agree that a non indo or afro should be our PM. Our gov't needs to reflect the need and realities of country. A non indo or afro wouldn't be able to relate to the majority races of the island so why should they lead them?
This is racist, but worse than that, it's just a poor argument. Why can't a non indo or afro relate to the races of the island?


Every year we see a population reduction coming from indos as they don't see TT improving under PNM. All walks of life indos ride out, especially the educated ones. Younger indo folk don't see much hope under PNM.


Every time PNM in power Indos migrate for a better live. Indos that remain here are mostly older folk and cant be bothered to migrate. These folk have their offspring living abroad and will most often spend long periods abroad visas permitting with them.

A large number of PNM ppl migrate aswell but they end up New York while most indos avoid that city. Florida, UK and Canada seems tobe indos preferred destinations

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Re: Basdeo Panday: “The PNM will Win the next General Election” ...

Postby Redress10 » December 11th, 2019, 11:12 am

Slartibarfast

How is it racist? Where in the world would you get a leader to be elected who doesn't reflect the racial composition of the country?

People are naturally tribal by nature so they seek familiarity in their leaders. If you disagree then please show me a black uk prime minister or a white president of china.

You all are not being realistic. Most minorities in TT live closed off from the rest of the population only interacting when it's time to interact with public service or for economic gains. Are you saying that these people would be able to relate to the other races of tt who they see as nothing more than dollar signs?

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Re: Basdeo Panday: “The PNM will Win the next General Election” ...

Postby Slartibartfast » December 11th, 2019, 11:58 am

Redress10 wrote:Slartibarfast

How is it racist? Where in the world would you get a leader to be elected who doesn't reflect the racial composition of the country?

People are naturally tribal by nature so they seek familiarity in their leaders. If you disagree then please show me a black uk prime minister or a white president of china.

You all are not being realistic. Most minorities in TT live closed off from the rest of the population only interacting when it's time to interact with public service or for economic gains. Are you saying that these people would be able to relate to the other races of tt who they see as nothing more than dollar signs?

In your original post you said "should not" implying that being of a certain race is a requirement on principle. It seemed as though you had a moral objection. That moral objection would have been racist. I disagreed with that.

This post argues that someone that is not afro or trini would not be able to become PM because of our current racial biases. If this better represents your point of view then I have no issue. I don't think anything is impossible but under our current circumstances I don't think we will see a non-afro or non-indo PM before 2030. Could be 2050 if people still consider voting for the lesser of two evils as an acceptable way forward.

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Re: Basdeo Panday: “The PNM will Win the next General Election” ...

Postby l33t2 » December 11th, 2019, 12:07 pm

Slartibartfast wrote:
l33t2 wrote:Your head in the right place but it's unrealistic, COP had the best momentum ever for a 3rd party and they did not win a seat. A 3rd party to succeedimg5 is extremely unlikely. And guess what? You'll end up with another 'corrupt' party after 5 years, just human nature especially here in tnt
That is because they hesitated and allowed themselves to be swallowed by the UNC. If they remained independent they would could have been a viable third party now. I think everybody's problem in this country is that we do not think long term.

Following your logic, do you think that UNC and PNM will last for the next 50 years, 100 years, 500 years, 1000 years? It's common knowledge that nothing lasts forever, so why treat the orange party like they are going to?

Also, how else do you expect change to start? They will meet their end somewhere and at sometime. This is how change starts. With one person, taking one action to start on a non-viable solution until it builds into something viable.

Voting the "lesser of two evils" just delays this change for the better so that we can continue down the same path that has been failing is for the last 10 years.

Again, I agree with you btw. You are correct when you say that a 3rd part succeeding is extemely unlikely. In fact I will say it is impossible for one to succeed in 2020, 5% chance for success in 2025 and maybe a 15% chance of success in 2030 if we stop voting for the lesser of two evils now. But if we continue, we just delay the inevitable. The PNM and UNC will end because all things that exist come to an end. The question is, how do you want it to end. In your control with some chance at a better future or when our economy just cant handle the poor leadership anymore and we end up like Venezuela.

Redress10 wrote:I also don't agree that a non indo or afro should be our PM. Our gov't needs to reflect the need and realities of country. A non indo or afro wouldn't be able to relate to the majority races of the island so why should they lead them?
This is racist, but worse than that, it's just a poor argument. Why can't a non indo or afro relate to the races of the island?


You're missing a major point though, what made UNC so bad? Almost nothing, every time they've been in power T&T goes through a rapid transformation and improvement in almost every area of governance. That is a fact, what UNC does in 5 years usually would take PNM 15 or never.

You really think COP was a viable alternative? Third parties are almost always a gimmick and window-dressing. They're idealistic and inexperienced.

Look at PEP, they are retards, it's as if you take the complainers in a company (unionized workers usually), the ones who complain about everything, as if they have all the answers, and then put them in charge.

What happens? Nothing, their plans don't work, they waste time and resources, they complain even more. The smart ones adapt and become the same thing they hated, the very good ones will do that, but fix some core issues. But that takes experience which most 3rd parties lack.

Secondly, we'll never get the best ppl in government unless they truly has a passion for politics. It isn't a easy life, constant scrutiny, criticism and lack of reward.

Tell me, why must I with my education and experience, wait 15 years to make a difference (if ever). You think I can string a long worthy people for 15 years or more with no real reward?

There is no such thing a viable 3rs party. If by some miracle they get into power or form a coalition government, guess what? They'll end up exactly like the former governments in some way. It's human nature.

We have 2 parties in Trinidad. One that's obviously controlled by the 1% and the other controlled by a different group (and some 1%) but they cater far more to the need of the people. They don't live in a bubble, they actively try to improve Trinidad.

Tell me where I'm wrong, I'm showing you how wrong your idealism is and how your 'good intentions' can lead to 15 years of PNM and the ultimate downfall of Trinidad.

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Re: Basdeo Panday: “The PNM will Win the next General Election” ...

Postby Redress10 » December 11th, 2019, 12:28 pm

Slartibartfast wrote:
Redress10 wrote:Slartibarfast

How is it racist? Where in the world would you get a leader to be elected who doesn't reflect the racial composition of the country?

People are naturally tribal by nature so they seek familiarity in their leaders. If you disagree then please show me a black uk prime minister or a white president of china.

You all are not being realistic. Most minorities in TT live closed off from the rest of the population only interacting when it's time to interact with public service or for economic gains. Are you saying that these people would be able to relate to the other races of tt who they see as nothing more than dollar signs?

In your original post you said "should not" implying that being of a certain race is a requirement on principle. It seemed as though you had a moral objection. That moral objection would have been racist. I disagreed with that.

This post argues that someone that is not afro or trini would not be able to become PM because of our current racial biases. If this better represents your point of view then I have no issue. I don't think anything is impossible but under our current circumstances I don't think we will see a non-afro or non-indo PM before 2030. Could be 2050 if people still consider voting for the lesser of two evils as an acceptable way forward.


The realities are that one race always feels disenfranchised because the other is in power hence "we time now" sentiments. What is going to happen when 90% of the population is governed by someone who isn't a part of either of the major races? Chaos. Societal instability etc.

Duke denied sandals because he said they were gonna make black boys into bell hops and waiters. They are not interested in non indo or afro leadership. Plain and simple.

Indos are pacified when unc is in power and afros are pacified when pnm is in power. That is the reality of the situation.

I believe that we need to elect rational leaders. It shouldn't matter what race because the leader would have a clear idea on how to govern and develop the country. Non of our leaders to date have been great. Not one

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Re: Basdeo Panday: “The PNM will Win the next General Election” ...

Postby Redress10 » December 11th, 2019, 12:41 pm

T33ts2

UNC only cares abt themselves bai. Nothing gets done unless is for some monetary gain that's why you get more projects etc. Somebody always always skimming off the top somewhere. Unc is abt creating projects just to divert public funds. No kinda economic rationality in place.

Where the massive PNM contracts to their financiers since PNM came into office since 2015? List them. Where is the PNM version of SIS? The problem is PNM don't do the same for their supporters so that's why real development takes place during PNM time. They are abt "market forces" and "supply and demand" economics. That is why things always "hard" under pnm.

Trinidad is based on falsities. False economics, false prosperity, false security, false unity etc. When we start facing our realities then things will change.

Check how easy it is for people to compare TT to venezuela. South american culture and politics is a different animal to what we practice here in TT but as they say talk is cheap.

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Re: Basdeo Panday: “The PNM will Win the next General Election” ...

Postby Blaze d Chalice » December 11th, 2019, 12:47 pm

Redress10 wrote:Indos are pacified when unc is in power and afros are pacified when pnm is in power. That is the reality of the situation.


You lost meh dey.

I think you mean emboldened.
For example look how the crime rate increases when Pnm is in charge, and most of the bandits/murderers/pests are Pnm voters/supporters. And look at the victims of the crimes (referring to robbery/home invasion/etc, not pest killing pest)

And don't say I being racial.
I watching the LGE results-map when I use the term pnm voters

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Re: Basdeo Panday: “The PNM will Win the next General Election” ...

Postby Slartibartfast » December 11th, 2019, 12:52 pm

Edit: Posted on next page cuz I know a long post at the end of a page will get ignored :lol:
Last edited by Slartibartfast on December 11th, 2019, 12:59 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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