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WRX to STi (04) Conversion...WTK

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Redeyeblueeye
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WRX to STi (04) Conversion...WTK

Postby Redeyeblueeye » March 8th, 2008, 5:40 pm

Tell meh...

What I need to get besides the VF30 Turbo and the STi TMIC?

Any thoughts on upgrades too that make sense outside of the spec STi that add value for money?

Oh and where can I get these stuff to buy...?

(I was told upgrading makes sense since my turbo is burning oil and making siren and bearing noises) :?

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Postby Alpha_2nr » March 9th, 2008, 7:21 am

You have PLENTY more work than just that.

STi and WRX engines are different to start with.

See my post here (WhiteGDA):

http://www.scoobytnt.com/forum/viewtopi ... 8177#48177

WhiteGDA wrote:The WRX engine (SDM) is different from the STi engine (JDM or sdm) so to start with (internals, cams, AVCS etc....you won't be doing a true STi "conversion"...more like a bump in WRX power....unless you're doing an entire rebuild. Then there's suspension..........

VF30 will require at a minimum a stock STi dp and STi injectors, along with a larger fuel pump. The STi TMIC is a lesser of your concerns, but should be done in the issue of safety (against knock/detonation). You'd prob need to change the hood scoop spiltter (The thing with the rubber gasket under the hood scoop on your car) to an STi spec one also, so that the rubber gasket seals properly over the larger TMIC (imo). It helps direct air over your intercooler to improve efficiency. People try a short cut without it......(removing the rubber "seal")....but it's there for a reason....try to stick with the larger one if you can get it.

Running the VF30 on a stock WRX DP, (esp if catted) is pointless IMHO. Getting a stock STI DP is also pointless IMHO (cost wise). Run an aftermarket DP (and uppipe if your stock up is catted also).


Then of course you're going to have to tune your car (Reflash/EMS etc)....after upgrades are done....if you want to have a properly running car for the near forseeable future that is.


Forgot to mention.....the SDM 04 WRX is not a twin scroll setup (up till when last I looked at one). So the VF30 will be the "Sti turbo of choice in most cases" / better bet vs. a Twin scroll STi 04 turbo (more cost effective) as it's single scroll.

In case you're not very well acquainted with Suby lingo...here's the cliff's notes version:

1) Older WRX's / STi's used single scroll turbos.

2) Newer STi's (04 up) used a twin scroll setup. This was done in conjunction with a different header / uppipe design / downpipe design.

Since your car is most likely single scroll.....your chosen turbo will work fine.

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Postby Alpha_2nr » March 9th, 2008, 7:27 am

THe STi differs in not only engine setup, but suspension, braking, drivetrain etc etc.

So all you'll be doing is something like a Stage 2.5-3 upgrade...involving a turbo swap w/ associated parts.

As for other mods outside the "STi" lineup... there are TONS of them.

Turbos from 300 hp-600 hp, water injec, FMIC, forged kits, and that's just the engine.

You have to decide WHAT you want from your car, and where your priorities lie, in terms of power and/or handling.

RESEARCH is your friend. Start reading up on int'l forums (give better advice as they have a larger base of tuned WRX's/STi's) like clubwrx.net.

Also, start browsing sites like vividracing.com, and aftermarket sites like Perrin, Agency Power, Deadbolt turbos etc.

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Postby JWT » March 9th, 2008, 6:29 pm

you will need the following

engine:

injectors
intercooler
turbo
gearbox 6speed
diff for the 6speed

or you can leave your car like that and just do some mods that may see you run down a sti

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Postby Alpha_2nr » March 10th, 2008, 5:50 am

gearbox 6speed
diff for the 6speed


Why does he need a 6 speed if he's going with a VF30 turbo?

This is unnecessary cost. Folks with 5 speeds have run up to GT30R's in the U.S. with no complaints....local cars have run VF30's, VF22's, 16G's and past the 310 chp on 5 speed tranny...with no complaints.

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Postby Redeyeblueeye » March 10th, 2008, 3:09 pm

Whats ur view on this knight 1 ... if indeed I am needing to change out the Turbo, go with the VF30? or back to the original turbo.
I thinking if the bolt up is straight fwd I can buy the bigger turbo and piping and Sti TMIC set up...and settle with the decat, injectors (pinks) and a good tune for now until I get this car working properly...???

My mechanic talking bout haltech piggy back, boost controller bigger intercooler...starting sounding $$ expensive too me now

I don't really wanna 'play' with car too much if u know what i mean...its my everyday driver NOT my 'project'

Advice...?

http://www.scoobytnt.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=3625

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Postby Alpha_2nr » March 11th, 2008, 12:46 pm

First off....you should be doing an ECU reflash if you want to tune for those upgrades.

Who uses boost controllers and piggybacks in Subarus anymore? Tell your mech to update his information on the superior ways to tune these cars. :roll:

Haltech and Standalone EMS are nice...but a bit much for the mods you're doing IMHO. Besides, the majority of the Suby community (and Evo) are moving away from EMS's into ECU-tunes. Both markets have ECu tuned cars well over the 400 whp range running as daily drivers.

If you mods are done properly, you won't have any problems with your car (once it's tuned properly also). Not to judge, but the mods your mech is suggesting sound like a nice way to rake up some extra cash ...for him.


As I stated before, if you want to have a reliable car, you'd need to do all the mods that I (and others) listed in the thread on TSOC.....and it'll be a great daily driver.

Injectors, Fuel Pump, Turbo, TMIC, decat DP. And I think you should change the hood scoop splitter as well to ensure proper function of the TMIC.

Those are the bare minimum stuff you'd need if you put in for that turbo swap. We haven't even talked about Uppipes and catback exhausts yet.


OR....


Just get a TD04 turbo (stock) and put it back in. Pretty simple. And tune the car to ensure you aren't detonating anymore. (will cost you alot less, seeing the other problems you've been listing).



P.S. Ecu tune is alot cheaper...and may even be free if you choose to DIY once you have a laptop, tactrix cable, and can download a generic "VF30" map for your car. Or you can have a specific tuner do it for you also (for a cost of course).

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Postby equipped2ripp » March 14th, 2008, 12:10 am

sigh

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Postby JWT » March 14th, 2008, 7:33 pm

Knight1 a wrx box is weak

putting power on that makes no sense

if he wants do the VF30 and injectors and tune but 310 is small power people does use that on their bmx now :lol:

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Postby 16 cycles » March 14th, 2008, 10:14 pm

^ allyuh go make the man spend more in the long run than buying an STi ...lol

Sti 6 speed + paraphanelia or price a PPG straight cut / dog box :shock:

i say save the pesos yes........have the wrx running efficient and safe and sell it to upgrade a few yrs / months later

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Postby Alpha_2nr » March 15th, 2008, 5:30 am

^^My point exactly. 6 speed is un needed. And the 6 speed's synchros can also fail with much abuse.

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Postby riderz » March 15th, 2008, 8:29 am

Hey Knight1 is right about the tuning options.

When I hear mechanics advising to put boostcontrollers in a Subaru then I know he in the 90s. Subys work better withou them. You want boost control, the stock ecu can be patched to accomodate it. Soon to be available.

Other than thet get a UTEC and plug it in.

Secondly with those mods listed and the budget you are observing, you could easily stay with a 5speed. I would not venture pass 320Whp with the 5spd. So you safe.


If you looking for an extra something sumthing, get a perrin EBCS or proodrive EBCS, get the taxtric cable and reflash connectors, and read as much as possible on romraider.com. You could tune the car yourself. You can even buy some maps at xpttuning for you specific application.

The stock ecu has full control of the vehicel, and you have all the maps in side like whats available in most aftermarket management systems. Subies and evo alike. Now there is launch control and some other sutff.

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Postby g unit » April 3rd, 2008, 5:46 am

is bess u save urself alllllllll that drama and buy a used one. might turn out cheaper and less stressful.

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Postby civcdrvrinwrx » May 20th, 2008, 2:51 pm

excellent stuff good read Knight 1
thanks for the info by the way (on scoobytnt I mean)

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Postby b18b_turbo » May 26th, 2008, 10:35 am

sell d wrx and buy an STI...it makes no sense...

wen u done, this converted car will have a VERY poor resale vlaue as well

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Postby JWT » May 26th, 2008, 1:34 pm

b18b_turbo wrote:sell d wrx and buy an STI...it makes no sense...

wen u done, this converted car will have a VERY poor resale vlaue as well


best advice there
:lol:

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Postby civcdrvrinwrx » May 27th, 2008, 3:57 pm

JWT wrote:
b18b_turbo wrote:sell d wrx and buy an STI...it makes no sense...

wen u done, this converted car will have a VERY poor resale vlaue as well


best advice there
:lol:

if you check the priceof an sti its cheaper to do the conversion
even with the 6 speed box
Gobin?

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Postby STi-N » May 27th, 2008, 5:09 pm

JWT wrote:Knight1 a wrx box is weak

putting power on that makes no sense

if he wants do the VF30 and injectors and tune but 310 is small power people does use that on their bmx now :lol:


wat sh!t u talking
the 5spd could take licks.. jus hada know how to drive it
it hav many WRXs on the road with their 5spd puttin out more power than sti's and their stock gearbox still dere

b18b_turbo wrote:sell d wrx and buy an STI...it makes no sense...

wen u done, this converted car will have a VERY poor resale vlaue as well


:roll:

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Postby civcdrvrinwrx » May 28th, 2008, 2:16 pm

STi-N wrote:
JWT wrote:Knight1 a wrx box is weak

putting power on that makes no sense

if he wants do the VF30 and injectors and tune but 310 is small power people does use that on their bmx now :lol:


wat sh!t u talking
the 5spd could take licks.. jus hada know how to drive it
it hav many WRXs on the road with their 5spd puttin out more power than sti's and their stock gearbox still dere

b18b_turbo wrote:sell d wrx and buy an STI...it makes no sense...

wen u done, this converted car will have a VERY poor resale vlaue as well


:roll:
'

i have heard that the 5 spd box cant take too much licks

what about launching it off the start with this much horses ???

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Postby riderz » May 28th, 2008, 2:42 pm

The 5 speed box have been known for failures. Not from launching though. The box itself doesnt provide enough fluid circulation to keep the gearsets cool and lubricated. The constant changes in hightemps causes some of the gears to develop hairline cracks over time. These cracks are further exploited to complete failures during excessive power transfers between the both shafts.

One of the teeth just lets go and makes that particular gear unusable. This is a normal thing with these boxes. Most WRX racers would either change the gearsets to a set cryo treated or to the 6spd box

Cryo treating gives about 30% more strength but they have been known to break in 400hp cars

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Postby civcdrvrinwrx » May 29th, 2008, 6:12 pm

:idea: what about just using an oil cooler would that work?
but more importantly are you saying you can launch the stock wrx without damaging it even after prolonged launching.
let say 320hp

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Postby JWT » May 29th, 2008, 7:18 pm

do not put an oil cooler in any wrx or sti unless you have upgraded your oil pump

that is installed a high volume oil pump

think of it stock pump pushing oil and you are pulling away about 1/2 qt of oil from the crank at the same psi level = spin bearing

upgraded oil pump push more psi and volume = safely installs an oil cooler

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Postby civcdrvrinwrx » May 30th, 2008, 9:55 am

^^^I meant for the gearbox you know :?

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Postby JWT » May 30th, 2008, 9:40 pm

amm why you need one for the gearbox

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Postby riderz » May 31st, 2008, 5:12 am

He is talking about cooling the oil in a WRX box. To tell you the truth I am not entirely sure it can be done effectively. Most people just strengthen the box of go with a dog gearset.

The problem with installing an oil cooler is you must have directed flow. The gearbox unfortunately doesnt accomodate it.

.......on another point........

JWT installing an oil cooler doesnt mean you have to install and aftermarket oil pump. The stock EJ20 (specifically) can handle the flow. What you need to do is add some extra oil to accomodate for the increased capacity of the oil cooler itself.

Subaru owners across the world have been doing it, and these cars have been used in international motor sports etc.

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Postby civcdrvrinwrx » May 31st, 2008, 7:17 pm

ok riderz thans for explaiming that

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