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Stock turbo... pushing the limits (Dyno Inside)

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Silvermike
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Stock turbo... pushing the limits (Dyno Inside)

Postby Silvermike » May 5th, 2011, 7:39 pm

Hey guys.

So in the interest of information sharing, I've decided to do a small write up on my build, tuning and results. My car is a 1999 6GSR. The specs that matter are as follows:

HKS272 cams
Fidanza cam gears (-4,-2)
Forged 2.0 L 9:1 CR
Fullrace prostock exhaust manifold
3" turbo-back exhuast
AMS intercooler /w 2.5 piping
680cc injectors
Stock evo 9 turbo /w 21psi forge actuator
Blitz SUS intake filter thru stock MAF
Methanol injection kit
Stock head, Stock IM, Stock TB, Stock drivetrain /w ACT clutch
Evo 7 ecu tuned by me via ecuflash

Tuning this on local premium (~91oct?) has not been a joy. The max boost i ran was 24psi, making 342hp/320tq by audi. Timing was very low, 12* out the top, EGTs where 850*c @ the top of 3rd. holding 11.0 afrs.

To combat the octane issue, I started mixing methanol into the fuel... what I found was 1 gallon of methanol : full tank gave me a good bump in octane. At this level I was able to run as high as 28psi, doing 380/380. 14* out the top, with similar afrs and EGT.

The final tune I did was to switch on methanol injection. This added even more octane and cooled the intake some more, allowing ~30psi peak. Tuned to 11.4afr. Below is the dyno result:

Image

Below is the log of the run:

Image

Because of the small turbo, boost drops off to 26psi @ peak power and 20psi at the end of the pull. This last tune gets the odd 2-3count knock >7krpm. I turned boost back down to 28psi for daily use.

Currently, I'm installing an O2 dump and swapping the HKS cams for GSC. Aim is to break 400. :-) please feel free to ask any questions/ offer advice.

Special thanks:

R.Mutt - for providing ecuflash support, definition files and general guidance in sorting out miscellaneous tuning issues which popped up. aka false knock! Also for helping witht he project R&D.

W2J - for being the plick that he is. And also for providing parts with great service and prices

Ricky - For his expertise in mechanics and a sturdy hand.
Last edited by Silvermike on May 29th, 2011, 11:47 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Rooki3
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Re: Stock turbo... pushing the limits.

Postby Rooki3 » May 5th, 2011, 7:42 pm

nice write up

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Re: Stock turbo... pushing the limits.

Postby Jimbo » May 9th, 2011, 7:35 am

So what happens when you go FP Black? :lol:

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Silvermike
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Re: Stock turbo... pushing the limits.

Postby Silvermike » May 9th, 2011, 9:04 am

^ not sure if im going that route. Im definitely keeping the stock turbo for the while... and playing a waiting game.

there is the GTX series by ATP that looks promising but lacks proper testing. Also, there are rumors of a dual BB black, or even a BB bbk-b. So for now, im content with abusing the stocker.

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Re: Stock turbo... pushing the limits.

Postby fras » May 9th, 2011, 4:37 pm

Same car?

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Silvermike
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Re: Stock turbo... pushing the limits.

Postby Silvermike » May 9th, 2011, 6:02 pm

yes, that was the first dyno, 24psi, 340whp. Also did a 26psi run later on for the 360, but that was when i started to mix meth in the tank...

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Re: Stock turbo... pushing the limits.

Postby Picasso » May 13th, 2011, 11:26 am

Great stuff Mikey

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Re: Stock turbo... pushing the limits.

Postby MaelstroM » May 22nd, 2011, 10:54 am

Subscribed..
Which meth kit are u using?

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Silvermike
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Re: Stock turbo... pushing the limits.

Postby Silvermike » May 22nd, 2011, 8:23 pm

coolmist. was runnning no controller, standard 450c jet.

im going to be installing the cgms controller, flow sensor and a 800cc jet.

Work is ongoing on the car, so far ive managed to port the head and match to the exhaust and intake manifolds. nothing much, just a general clean up and matching. Also, exedy twin is going in, O2 dump and the custom gsc cams.

For the turbo, i still need to port the hotside, and i wanna put on a 84mm surge port for the inlet. with that setup i hope i can generate more flow uptop to allow a fatter powerband.

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Re: Stock turbo... pushing the limits.

Postby Silvermike » May 22nd, 2011, 9:13 pm

Here are some pics of the porting that ive been doing:

This is the O2 dump
Image

Unported ex manifold
Image

1/2 Ported ex manifold
Image

Ported ex maniold
Image

Ported intake runner
Image

Ported intake port
Image

Polished intake port
Image

Image

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Re: Stock turbo... pushing the limits.

Postby Jimbo » May 23rd, 2011, 8:52 am

Love it man!!! Who is doing the porting/polishing for you?

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Re: Stock turbo... pushing the limits.

Postby Silvermike » May 23rd, 2011, 12:47 pm

a friend of mine

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Re: Stock turbo... pushing the limits.

Postby R. Mutt » May 24th, 2011, 10:07 pm

Very nice!

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Re: Stock turbo... pushing the limits (Dyno Inside)

Postby A172 » June 2nd, 2011, 5:44 pm

great numbers

mike, how hard is it to source this turbo locally? and what would you say is a fair price for it?

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Silvermike
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Re: Stock turbo... pushing the limits (Dyno Inside)

Postby Silvermike » June 2nd, 2011, 10:08 pm

3500 used. It sells for about 1k usd new.

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Re: Stock turbo... pushing the limits (Dyno Inside)

Postby R. Mutt » June 7th, 2011, 8:49 pm

what's the status with the car?

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Re: Stock turbo... pushing the limits (Dyno Inside)

Postby ecktt » June 9th, 2011, 6:21 pm

Nice numbers. Are you running Tephra V7? I've been playing with methanol too. It really helps with knock at 6k-7k rpm. It also all but cleared up some low load knock that simply refused to be tuned out. I've been getting away with 10L of meth on a tank of gas for the better part of this year. No ill effects so far.

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Silvermike
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Re: Stock turbo... pushing the limits (Dyno Inside)

Postby Silvermike » June 9th, 2011, 8:35 pm

Yes, tepha V7. I typically run 1 gal/ full tank. From the research i did, a 10% or less mix will have no long term effects. High concentrations eat at the lining of the fuel tank, and eventually lead to corrosion. It also eats away at injector seals, pump seals and fuel lines.

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Re: Stock turbo... pushing the limits (Dyno Inside)

Postby 16 cycles » June 10th, 2011, 12:49 pm

good work mike.....following this build since you brought it back into circulation after a couple years......

had the opp to run against it .....plane lengths i got - the 55whp/tq showed that day ...biting tires all on four up to fourth ....was good to see it run....

great dedication to research and DIY shows in the build.....

hope you attain the flat tq curve you're looking for.....

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Re: Stock turbo... pushing the limits (Dyno Inside)

Postby De Dragon » June 19th, 2011, 2:57 pm

How long have you had this setup? I'm looking to do something pretty similiar, and my car is a DD so I need it to be reliable.

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Re: Stock turbo... pushing the limits (Dyno Inside)

Postby Silvermike » June 19th, 2011, 4:03 pm

been up and running 2 1/2 yrs now. only started to push the setup this yr really. This car sat comfortably @ 350whp @ 24-25psi.

Progress has slowed. I swapped out the water jackets on the block, and the water line and water pump as well. I ran into problems trying to take off the old flywheel as the bolts got stuck, had to practically destroy them to get it off, but its done now, and new twin disc installed, gearbox back up as well.

The head is now fully assembled and i should be mounting it all back up together in the coming week.

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Re: Stock turbo... pushing the limits (Dyno Inside)

Postby Silvermike » June 19th, 2011, 4:09 pm

Here are some shots of the head after the polish:
Image
Image
Image

Clutch on the motor, at last:
Image

Prettied up gearbox:
Image

Polished Intake Manifold
Image

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Re: Stock turbo... pushing the limits (Dyno Inside)

Postby De Dragon » June 20th, 2011, 2:13 pm

^^^ Dais wey we talkin' 'bout!

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Re: Stock turbo... pushing the limits (Dyno Inside)

Postby Picasso » June 29th, 2011, 7:17 am

Looking good indeed

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xtech
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Re: Stock turbo... pushing the limits (Dyno Inside)

Postby xtech » July 10th, 2011, 1:42 pm

so who could tune a 4G63T from the Galant VR4 with a EVO8 ecu that running TephraMod V7?

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Kronik
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Re: Stock turbo... pushing the limits (Dyno Inside)

Postby Kronik » July 10th, 2011, 11:53 pm

it any different from tuning a evo one? which rom id?

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xtech
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Re: Stock turbo... pushing the limits (Dyno Inside)

Postby xtech » July 11th, 2011, 3:30 am

no different.............unless u pop the hood u an yuh software will think u are tuning a EVO8 4G63T with small injectors and a TD04

The car is running just need someone with proper fine tuning tools to give it a run over an prep it as a daily driver to run on our crap gas and set up a secondary map for race days.

and maybe enable more tephra mod goodies

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Re: Stock turbo... pushing the limits (Dyno Inside)

Postby Kronik » July 11th, 2011, 11:03 am

which rom id you using? 9417? 9653? i running 96532706.

our gas not that crappy actually, i believe in california they have 89oct gas to tune for, now that is stress. well i still waiting to get my wideband to do mine, but regarding the tephra mods there are a couple more additions you might be interested in that tephra didnt do

thermo fan duty (control fan speeds ac+main at different speeds/temperatures)
ignition retard limit (so you can retard the ignition more than -10)
code change for stat rev limiter (use this if your stationary rev limiter not working)
min coolant temp for closed loop

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Re: Stock turbo... pushing the limits (Dyno Inside)

Postby xtech » July 11th, 2011, 7:42 pm

oh yeah i put on 96530706

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Re: Stock turbo... pushing the limits (Dyno Inside)

Postby Kronik » July 11th, 2011, 10:41 pm

you got past the cold start issues?

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