MY WERD!!! She Breathing Right NOW!!

[SR]

yup i learnin too

[nemesis]

In the end it all depends on what you want power wise, and how much you're willing to spend. Of course you can't say you want 400whp for 10kttd, but you know what I mean.
Consider all the aspects of the engines too, other than strength cause I'm sure either will be strong enough for your uses.
For example, stock 257's are only guaranteed for rev limiters to 6500rpm. 207's are 7500. But then 257's spool earlier, have more torque etc. So if you want both cases, then you spend a lot and get balanced internals for the 257.

Basically you can go any which way you want with these engines since enough options exist. So figure out your budget, then figure out what's the best combination. You might just find that in the end you prefer to drop in a stock engine and tune it well.

[SR]

i am happy with my stock setup and re tuned ecu

bought a car i can drive in comfort with some level of sportiness and performance as a daily driver

[copper_shot]

viewtopic.php?f=12&t=354376

^ brand new engine block with internals...

[nemesis]

Yeah, and he selling 2.5's whole also if you want.

[Monk BANzai]

took heads off ...will update with pics later...

my decision is to go with a STI block, and STI injectors and some other "Add ons" and go back up.

[Alpha_2nr]

^^2.0L EJ207 block? Well it's stronger.........don't know how the heads fit? Could have probably looked at larger injectors since you're in there (as in larger than STi units) in the event you want more headroom.

[nemesis]

Heads should fit. I know they fit on the 257, so 207 shouldn't be any issue.
Which STI block are you going with btw?
I believe stock injectors could max out the turbo you have..but if you wanted headroom for a turbo change later you might as well change them now.
Changing all internals?

[Monk BANzai]

changing pistons, bearings and rods...

some images..... Legas Head....


up close of the too lwe were using that had to be modified to take off the heads...


STI heads (off the GC8)...


another angle of the Legas heads


from what we've seen this is the first time the engine has been opened. That was a concern seeing it had a dodgy history after 2007.

[dok_tec]

aren't the ej207 blocks the ones that came in the bugeye spec c's with a semiclosed deck and forged internals?from what i gather that is the best block subaru made they can take in excess of 450whp BUT they are expensive brand new like in excess of $3000us new comparable to a rallispec built block(blueprinted $3500us) which would be a better buy neways. Both of those options would have been my first choice simply for one main reason NO PISTON SLAP which no matter what if you rebuild down here you're gonna get at least at warm up and even at operating temperature also for some reason rebuilt subaru engines dont end up being high mileage engines (please dont quote me on this its just what i read over a period of time) maybe because their owners tend to beat on them harder.
http://forums.nasioc.com/forums/showthr ... nt+mileage

Best way to describe subaru blocks "a subaru shortblock is like virgin once you split it open its never quite the same".
Be uber careful with any boring done dont go 100mm!, make sure torque plate used, if you have to take off any take off as little as possible they are already open deck blocks.

here is my recent rebuild still on 700km(exams keeping me back right now)






went with stock bore wisecos because honestly i fear our local machine shops and my block was near perfect so i just did a light hone and i only get piston slap on warm ups and it goes away so hopefully it should work out(the coating just reduces friction and helps with piston slap it doesnt affect blowby) and manley h beam over eagles just because they come balanced
ACL bearing
new oem oil pump
belts
engine gasket set
arp studs

oh yea i cracked a ringland on vf43

[nemesis]

Manley do make good rods. Haven't used eagle myself but having seen some issues with them locally I chose not to use myself.
Also haven't heard of many blocks being screwed up locally. Heads however, are a different situation.
Forged pistons are almost always louder than stock, especially on startup as they have different expansion characteristics.
A few thou overbore may not be too bad (just very few 2-3), as the little extra blowby is ok for running high pressure if you do decide to go 400whp.
You also have the option of using the Mahle pistons which are low expansion and are lighter. They actually recommend boring to exactly the size of piston you bought. So simply honing stock may work even better.

[Monk BANzai]

agreed on the local machine shop issue. Been getting near 100% reports of fear and mayhem from the local guys that did work, though one guy from Arima said he took his stuff to those ppl up in Arima (thier name escapes me right now) and got near perfect work from them.

Seeing as I have and extra block to work with i am really appreciative of all the advice those far. Dok_tek...give me some more info on those rods though....

Nemesis, i raelly want to go back up with about 220-240whp. the other block i'd build out for the 400hp plus...

[nemesis]

Ok, you're losing me here. You're building two blocks, one for 220whp and one for 400whp? You're running two cars or wha? Or you're intending to have an extra block built wrongly sitting on the side?
Just build one good one and hope it lasts!
Anyway, guy in Arima is Baldwin right? He used to be quite good, but I think has a case of too much work. Made a mess of a few heads recently I know. No blocks though, those all seem to be good.
Actually if you want the block just cleaned and honed properly you could go by Central Precision. They do it just fine. Depending of course on your location.
And don't hone too fine as I see a lot of people doing.

[dok_tec]

yea the manley h beam rods come balanced with the figures for each rod written on the individual box they come in so its one less thing you have to depend on a machine shop to do for you.They are pretty strong not an i beam strength but more than enough for my application i would say around 500whp safely.Both the eagle and manleys are made in china but the manleys are finished (balanced,buffed,inspected) in the states and go through a more exacting quality control

[Monk BANzai]

more bad news. Cam Journals damaged. So either i take them to get machined or I look for a pr of new heads. Damage was due to drop in oil pressure.


grrrrrr

[VexXx Dogg]

fawwk
sorry to hear that...

[nemesis]

In that case you might want to just buy a whole new engine if you intend to keep cost down. Buying heads and block seperately, then forging and making sure the heads are good will cost quite a bit.

[B-TORF]

Rawle, just call Navin and get a whole engine.

All that building is gonna be very pricey and time consuming.

Whether or not you are keeping the car, a full engine replacement is your best option given the kinda damage listed.

Just replace the engine, eliminate excessive downtime and cost, and yuh good to go again.

It is nice to know that there is such a wealth of Subie knowledge on the forum, but pardna, here's what, downtime=money.

[B-TORF]

i am happy with my stock setup and re tuned ecu

bought a car i can drive in comfort with some level of sportiness and performance as a daily driver

Smart.

Know what yuh buy or own. A Legacy is a beautiful balance of luxury and performance.

It certainly ain't the platform to be making all those modifications, because at the end of the day, you will be disappointed with the results compared to the coin spent.

[copper_shot]

^ X2.....

[VexXx Dogg]

i am happy with my stock setup and re tuned ecu

bought a car i can drive in comfort with some level of sportiness and performance as a daily driver

Smart.

Know what yuh buy or own. A Legacy is a beautiful balance of luxury and performance.

It certainly ain't the platform to be making all those modifications, because at the end of the day, you will be disappointed with the results compared to the coin spent.

I beg to differ(regarding the highlighted)
It was more expensive and harder to make power in the Honda....
The legacy is a hard platform to work with, compared to an impreza. It depends on application, really. A legacy can make a good street demon. It certainly wont be as tossable as an impreza, but there are a lot of competitve cars that are just as heavy. It all boils down to how the car is setup and how the driver can handle it.
Obviously it has no place on dirt/mud, but on the street or dex (maybe even circuit if prepped properly).
Maybe I'm just 'harden' - i think its an interesting project...but if the intention is to keep the car for 3-5 years then sell, it does not make sense to throw a lot of coin behind it. I'm building mine on the premise that I'm in it for the long haul.

[B-TORF]

i am happy with my stock setup and re tuned ecu

bought a car i can drive in comfort with some level of sportiness and performance as a daily driver

Smart.

Know what yuh buy or own. A Legacy is a beautiful balance of luxury and performance.

It certainly ain't the platform to be making all those modifications, because at the end of the day, you will be disappointed with the results compared to the coin spent.

I beg to differ(regarding the highlighted)
It was more expensive and harder to make power in the Honda....

Certainly isn't more expensive for a Honda, but with the Legacy you start at a higher point in the power band, in addition to being turbo-charged.

The legacy is a hard platform to work with, compared to an impreza. It depends on application, really. A legacy can make a good street demon. It certainly wont be as tossable as an impreza, but there are a lot of competitve cars that are just as heavy. It all boils down to how the car is setup and how the driver can handle it.

Just the point I was making. You have to know what you have and what you want to do with it. The car is set up pretty damn ok for what it was intended. A performance based, economic, luxury sedan.

Obviously it has no place on dirt/mud, but on the street or dex (maybe even circuit if prepped properly).
Maybe I'm just 'harden' - i think its an interesting project...

To each his/her own.

but if the intention is to keep the car for 3-5 years then sell, it does not make sense to throw a lot of coin behind it.

And that was all I was saying. If Rawle's plan is to keep, then go all out bruh............but be practical when making your decision.

I'm building mine on the premise that I'm in it for the long haul.

Would love to see how your build progresses.

[nemesis]

Whey. All ah dat and the man with the problem eh respond yet.
Welllll : 1. You can get a Legacy to do quite good roadholding i agree. Never will feel quite right for overall 'handling' though.
2. Many platforms are great depending on what you want to build. If you just wanted a road rocket the Legacy probably wasn't the best choice cause even a 10+yr old R32 for half the price could kill it with half the list of mods. But then you knew that before you bought it right? So you wanted a mixture of various things that the Legacy provides..so no one should count all out performance as a reason for their decision.
3. As for stock performance being good. It is, for what it's meant to do. Have seen very few that actually felt like they had low end kick though. And not one was stock, or even close. That's even though the manufacturer claims max torque at 2200rpm..wierdness. This is a trait that all 'luxury' cars should have. Makes it easier to drive. But then cars that have that are way more expensive.

Soo, basically you're left with a car that's not all performance, not quite luxury, not very expensive, but definitely not the cheapest....so basically an all kinda mix up ting.
Chose your mods based solely on which direction YOU would like to sway it. AFTER you decide which way you're going then look for people with experience in going that way. Ah mean, if you decide to put in a NA engine and 22" chromes then we all discussing nothing right? And I sure a thread like that would have had different people posting.

[B-TORF]

Ah mean, if you decide to put in a NA engine and 22" chromes then we all discussing nothing right?

Hahahahahaha.............dat would be the day!!

[Monk BANzai]

lol...

honestly apart from this engine nightmare i really love the cars....best balance of luxury and sport thats within range for me. But it is frustrating. I never wanted it to come to this. I had to buy a STI turbo in the first instance cuz everyone hogging thier VF38's and I cudnt get one. And now this. I not toting, cuz as i said it comes with the territory...i just wish that when ppl are selling their cars that they are as honest as they can be. That and availability of parts is a headache. I called Navin, and he said he has none, but then again Navin always tells me that, and then when i send someone else the parts are there....*shrugs....

Gobin has been a world of help thus far, and his advice he gave me has me thinking alot. But it is what it is. Ive spent on a GC8 Sti head and block thus far, and if someone can link me with a legas Head and block i'd sell the GC8 and pick up the Legas.Short of that its taking the heads to a machine shop (Zigs or another one in Central, Qualitech Engineering down Point Lisas) and build back up the shfts adn re machine them down....alot of work IMO for a fix, but as always ppl seem to be holding onto thier parts like its Vtec....

it is what it is.

[Monk BANzai]

Another question...in my search for heads..are the Singapore models different from the Japanese spec? I was told that the coil pack positioning is different.

confirm?

[SR]

honda vs legacy regarding coin to modify...........................


after having owned 4 eg hatchbacks with b16/b18 conversions upgrades

out of the box stock the legacy has more power than the spoon but the agility and power to weight ratio made the eh hatch very sportable and raceable on a track and honeslty it still s more fun to drive but on a different level

the ride comfort with great handling makes the legacy a good upgrade for me but as said before i am happy with the stock setup and ecu retune

it is more than sufficient for daily driving on spirited running on the highway

there is no track so there is no incentive for me to do anything more

dex is not the place for me with the legacy
its too much stress on the tyres and suspension for a 1 minute run as well as the long run cost od suspension servicing being aluminium there is only so much times you can replace bushings and ball joints or meet the wrong machine shop and poof the entire cradle needs to be replaced


i didnt buy the car to race there is no track coin is not justified for mods for just a late night run or to be a dyno queen

[dok_tec]

^^^^ i hear where ur coming from but if it were me and in a way a suggestion how about working on heat protection to bring down under the hood temps.the tmic really does get quite a bit of heat soak.
wrapping down pipe, dei heat spraying end tanks of tmic, maybe upgrade to a bigger tmic and retune, buy a turbo blanket, wrap spray headers and put back on heat shields.

[VexXx Dogg]

Banzai, did you check aditi enterprises in gasparillo? (i cant remember if I said this before)
I think he had some engine parts from a scrapped BL5

[VexXx Dogg]

Regarding the parts: viewtopic.php?f=6&t=342173&hilit=legacy+parts