The Religion Discussion

[sMASH]

they have started a movement in what can be called the opposite direction to what they have determined the anti-christ's direction to be. every year or so they have a retreat at different places around the world. this year i believe it was in south africa, and last year was held in barrakpore.
i have downloaded his lecture at the barrakporre retreat.
that lecture is eye opening, but some what conspiracy theory with the jews. but it makes sense.

a supervisor where i work, an avid christian, speaks out against the modern banking system and how evil it is, and sometimes add that the islamic way of dealing with finances would be better for the world. in india, i'm not sure if it is the government of the city or individual companies, but they have resorted to having their female employees be escorted home after work due to the high rates of rape against them. that is similar to the buddy system being taught in america for women to have some sort of protection against potential assailants. this has been law in islam since inception, but may have been exaggerated, and misinterpreted as suppression.

[dark_lord_tnt]

a supervisor where i work, an avid christian, speaks out against the modern banking system and how evil it is, and sometimes add that the islamic way of dealing with finances would be better for the world. in india, i'm not sure if it is the government of the city or individual companies, but they have resorted to having their female employees be escorted home after work due to the high rates of rape against them. that is similar to the buddy system being taught in america for women to have some sort of protection against potential assailants. this has been law in islam since inception, but may have been exaggerated, and misinterpreted as suppression.

In India and America the women have choices, In islam they dont!.. but i must admit its safer by islamic law.

[QG]

Season's Greetings to each and all!

[sMASH]

[Razkal]

My Muslim bro gave me a dvd created by 2 islamic guys showing you the corrupted system we live in (The Arrivals).
They believe in the Anti-Christ just like we Christians do.
I am really learning alot, I picking up one or two arabian languages as well
I haven't looked at all 41 or 42 chapters as yet but I am getting there.

Islam is the way of life...not really a religion as some people call it. They believe Jesus was a messenger sent by God with healing gifts, but he rose to Heaven before he was killed.

Israel is a very IMPORTANT Nation, to Muslims and Christians alike, because in the Bible states that 3 Nations (European etc etc) will attack Israel and They Shall Fall leaving Israel standing!!
In Islam, they believe that Israel is their origin that they would reclaim it one day from the SONS of ISRAEL (JEWS).
I see many similariities between Islam and Christianity.
We both believe in the BOOK OF MOSES!

I hope that we all can learn from each other because there are knowledge from both sides THAT MAKES SENSE when combined! I was very amazed as to what I have learnt.... stay tuned!

islam is just watered down, pilfered teachings of older, original Judaic teachings and faiths...its the youngest of the abrahamic 'religions' and so naturally will indicate similarities and parallels between its teachings and that of Christianity/Judaism.

i strongly recommend you guys find and read, Christopher Hitchens: God is not great. not with the intention to impose atheistic beliefs but do educate yourselves on the history of most mainstream faiths in the modern world. Hitchens is an unparalleled journalist with the fervor of a scientist for the truth...his work is thought provoking in the least.

[sMASH]

okies

[Rocketraz1982]

that lecture is eye opening, but some what conspiracy theory with the jews. but it makes sense.

a supervisor where i work, an avid christian, speaks out against the modern banking system and how evil it is, .

Well the modern banking system is controlled by the Rothchild family and has a very twisted past regarding jews.. link:: http://www.iamthewitness.com/DarylBradf ... schild.htm tone of reading but skip over and you will get the idea....

[QG]

My Muslim bro gave me a dvd created by 2 islamic guys showing you the corrupted system we live in (The Arrivals).
They believe in the Anti-Christ just like we Christians do.
I am really learning alot, I picking up one or two arabian languages as well
I haven't looked at all 41 or 42 chapters as yet but I am getting there.

Islam is the way of life...not really a religion as some people call it. They believe Jesus was a messenger sent by God with healing gifts, but he rose to Heaven before he was killed.

Israel is a very IMPORTANT Nation, to Muslims and Christians alike, because in the Bible states that 3 Nations (European etc etc) will attack Israel and They Shall Fall leaving Israel standing!!
In Islam, they believe that Israel is their origin that they would reclaim it one day from the SONS of ISRAEL (JEWS).
I see many similariities between Islam and Christianity.
We both believe in the BOOK OF MOSES!

I hope that we all can learn from each other because there are knowledge from both sides THAT MAKES SENSE when combined! I was very amazed as to what I have learnt.... stay tuned!

islam is just watered down, pilfered teachings of older, original Judaic teachings and faiths...its the youngest of the abrahamic 'religions' and so naturally will indicate similarities and parallels between its teachings and that of Christianity/Judaism.

i strongly recommend you guys find and read, Christopher Hitchens: God is not great. not with the intention to impose atheistic beliefs but do educate yourselves on the history of most mainstream faiths in the modern world. Hitchens is an unparalleled journalist with the fervor of a scientist for the truth...his work is thought provoking in the least.

Scene!!

[QG]

I looked at the video and is surprised that this came from Greek Archives. I never heard what the Greek had to say about Jesus so I am thankful for this video...guess I need to use google.com or youtube more often lol.
What is true, there are many writings on Jesus that comes in different books and some people will go out of the way to mix truth with lies and create a image of Jesus to what they want others to see.

In that same video they see Jesus as just a man and does not talk about his spiritual birth, but in the Quran and the Bible talks about Maryam (Mary) and the spiritual birth of Jesus. So People will leave out valid information to get others to believe what they want (an example in the video).

[bluefete]

These evolutionists are really confused all because they ignore that God is real.

Lucy was already discredited as a model for the missing link in evolution.

The most important metatarsal in history: Fossil shows man walked tall 3 million years ago

By David Derbyshire
Last updated at 8:16 AM on 11th February 2011

It was a small step for an apeman, but a giant leap for mankind.

Scientists have pinpointed the moment when our ancestors finally abandoned the trees to walk upright like modern people.

In a breakthrough that helps rewrite human evolution, researchers have found a fossilised foot bone from an early human relative who strolled confidently on two legs more than 3.2million years ago.

The finding ends decades of debate about when our ancestors first began to walk like modern man, rather than clambering around the trees like gorillas and chimps.

Breakthrough: Researchers have found a fossilised foot bone from an early human relative who walked on two legs more than 3.2million years ago

Proof: The bone found is the fourth metatarsal, which helps connect the toes and foot muscle to the rest of the skeleton

The bone belonged to Australopithecus afarensis - a creature best known from the discovery of 'Lucy', whose partial skeleton was dug up in Ethiopia in 1974.

The fossil shows that Lucy’s feet had fixed arches, a trait only found in humans and which evolve to cope with the strains of running and walking long distances.

'Now that we know Lucy and her relatives had arches in their feet, this affects much of we know about them, from where they lived to what they ate and how they avoided predators,' said Dr Carol Ward, professor of integrative anatomy at the University of Missouri, who led the study.

'The development of arched feet was a fundamental shift toward the human condition, because it meant giving up the ability to use the big toe for grasping branches, signalling that our ancestors had finally abandoned life in the trees in favour of life on the ground.'

Lucy had a smaller brain and stronger jaw than a modern person. Her species lived between 3.7million and 2.9million years ago and were known to be able to walk on two feet.

However, researchers do not know whether she spent most of their time on all fours, climbing and swinging through trees like monkeys - or whether she walked upright like people.(Guessing games galore by these scientists.)

A 3-D model of the 3.2 million-year-old hominid known as Lucy, whose partial skeleton was discovered in 1974. The new evidence proves she walked upright

The newly discovered bone is a complete fourth metatarsal - one of the long bones that connects the toe to the base of the foot.

The bone shows that Lucy’s family had stiff, arched feet strong enough to push off against the ground, and flexible enough to absorb shock.

With human-like arches in its feet, Australopithecus afarensis was able to roam the countryside and leave the forest to forage for food when necessary.

With its strong jaws, Australopithecus could also eat several types of food, including fruit, seeds, nuts and roots. Combining their strong jaws and their new skill of walking, Lucy and her relatives were able to live in open areas as well as wooded ones.

Australopithecus was a new kind of creature - very different from earlier species like Ardipithecus ramidus, which came before Lucy and which moved on all fours, or upright, depending on the situation.

Arches in the feet are a key component of human-like walking because they absorb shock and also provide a stiff platform so that we can push off from our feet and move forward,' Dr Ward said.

'People today with "flat feet" who lack arches have a host of joint problems throughout their skeletons.

'Understanding that the arch appeared very early in our evolution shows that the unique structure of our feet is fundamental to human locomotion.

'If we can understand what we were designed to do and the natural selection that shaped the human skeleton, we can gain insight into how our skeletons work today.

'Arches in our feet were just as important for our ancestors as they are for us.'

The discovery of the bone, at Hadar Ethiopia, is reported in the journal Science.

Before the discovery of Lucy in the 1970s, fossil experts argued that Homo erectus - an ancestor living from 1.8 million to 70,000 years ago - was the first member of the family tree to walk properly upright.

The new study confirms that the date for confident upright walking is between one and two million years earlier.

Dr Ward said: 'We have know that Australopithecus were thus first committed upright biped, but have long debated whether they also spent significant time climbing trees, and whether their anatomy and movement reflected this compromise.

'This new fossil provides strong evidence that their stiff, arched feet were fully humanlike and that they had relinquished proficient climbing abilities in favor of a commitment to life on the ground.'

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sciencetech/ ... z1E7esgytP

[bluefete]

Spotlight: Have Humans Evolved to Believe in God?

By Caitlin Dickson | February 04, 2011 3:42pm

Is God a singular, independent being? Or just an evolved projection of human's theory of what God should be? Slate's Jesse Bering finds himself asking these heady questions after an analysis of how humans, as a species, have developed to analyze and rationalize the mental states of others--human or not.

Understanding the Theory of Mind: How Humans Attempt to Make Sense of the Unexpected

If you've ever seen an unfortunate woman at the grocery store wearing a midriff-revealing top and packed into a pair of lavender tights like meat in a sausage wrapper, or a follicularly challenged man with a hairpiece two shades off and three centimeters adrift, and asked yourself what on Earth those people were thinking when they looked in the mirror before leaving the house, this is a good sign that your theory of mind (not to mention your fashion sense) is in working order. When others violate our expectations for normalcy or stump us with surprising behaviors, our tendency to mind-read goes into overdrive. We literally "theorize" about the minds that are causing ostensible behavior.

Humans Extend 'Theory of Mind' to Inhuman Objects

Many people remember fondly the classic film Le Ballon Rouge ("The Red Balloon," 1956) by French filmmaker Albert Lamorisse, in which a sensitive schoolboy—in reality Lamorisse's own 5-year-old son, Pascal—is befriended by a good-natured, cherry-red helium balloon. Absent dialogue, the camera follows the joyful two, boy and balloon, through the somber, working-class streets of the Ménilmontant neighborhood of Paris ... The plot of Le Ballon Rouge exemplifies how our evolved brains have become hypersocial filters, such that our theory of mind is applied not only to the mental innards of other people and animals, but also, in error, to categories that haven't any mental innards at all, such as ebullient skins of elastic stretched by an inert gas. If it weren't for our theory of mind, we couldn't follow the premise of the movie, let alone enjoy Lamorisse's particular oeuvre of magical realism.

We Even Get Angry at Our Cars

In particular, when inanimate objects do unexpected things, we sometimes reason about them just as we do for oddly behaving—or misbehaving—people. More than a few of us have kicked our broken-down vehicles in the sides and verbally abused our incompetent computers. Most of us stop short of actually believing these objects possess mental states—indeed, we would likely be hauled away to an asylum if we genuinely believed that they held malicious intent—but our emotions and behaviors toward such objects seem to betray our primitive, unconscious thinking: we act as though they're morally culpable for their actions.

How This Leads to God

What if I were to tell you that God's mental states, too, were all in your mind? That God, like a tiny speck floating at the edge of your cornea producing the image of a hazy, out-of-reach orb accompanying your every turn, was in fact a psychological illusion, a sort of evolved blemish etched onto the core cognitive substrate of your brain? ... Consider, briefly, the implications of seeing God this way, as a sort of scratch on our psychological lenses rather than the enigmatic figure out there in the heavenly world that most people believe Him to be. Subjectively, God would still be present in our lives. (For some people, rather annoyingly so.) He would continue to suffuse our experiences with an elusive meaning and give the sense that the universe is communicating with us in various ways. But this notion of God as an illusion is a radical and, some would say, even dangerous idea because it raises important questions about whether God is an autonomous, independent agent that lives outside human brain cells, or instead a phantom cast out upon the world by our species' own peculiarly evolved theory of mind. Since the human brain, like any physical organ, is a product of evolution, and since natural selection works without recourse to intelligent forethought, this mental apparatus of ours evolved to think about God quite without need of the latter's consultation, let alone His being real.

http://www.theatlanticwire.com/opinions ... n-God-6864


If the human brain is a "product of evolution", what were the circumstances that led to random speech as we know it in humans? Were we better adapters to our environment than other animals? Where did our superiority over the animal kingdom come from? Are the other animals still evolving? Could we one day truly end up with a "Planet of the Apes" scenario where apes surpass us in their evolution?

[Duane 3NE 2NR]

^ but we are primates - one ape has already surpassed the other.
I think you still do not understand how evolution works.

if we evolved differently than we are now, how would we know?
We can only accept what we have evolved into as "normal" and base our beliefs and superstitions on that.

[illumin@ti]

Duane.... still? come on man *goes back to hermit mode*

[Duane 3NE 2NR]

ah sorry - dunno why I open this thread for nah

[Ronnie203]

Take a lil read.....and change

http://www.spiritlessons.com/Documents/ ... /index.htm

[sMASH]

in an attempt to help save this thread, here's an update of epic proportions

[brainchild]

Ok my thread got locked...i'm guessing because of this one.

So as i was asking...answer me this....If everyone claims there God is the true God...how come he or they as the case may be never appeared to the people on the other side of the world and taught the same things, used the same names etc?

Although their was hundreds of years of speculation, no one actually explored until Columbus' expedition...and the rest is history.

I'm no atheist, just wondered what peoples thoughts are on this. I'm not talking about so called modern day miracles, the modern bible or peoples visions. I'm just curious as to how this can be rationalized in the context of religious teachings.

[megadoc1]

Ok my thread got locked...i'm guessing because of this one.

So as i was asking...answer me this....If everyone claims there God is the true God...how come he or they as the case may be never appeared to the people on the other side of the world and taught the same things, used the same names etc?

Although their was hundreds of years of speculation, no one actually explored until Columbus' expedition...and the rest is history.

I'm no atheist, just wondered what peoples thoughts are on this. I'm not talking about so called modern day miracles, the modern bible or peoples visions. I'm just curious as to how this can be rationalized in the context of religious teachings.

well the true and living God the HOLY one of Israel sent out men (his disciples) to do so

Mar 16:15 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.
Mar 16:16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

Mat 28:18 And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.
Mat 28:19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
Mat 28:20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

this is the way God chose to do it
God used the children of Israel to make himself known to the world

[brainchild]

Ok my thread got locked...i'm guessing because of this one.

So as i was asking...answer me this....If everyone claims there God is the true God...how come he or they as the case may be never appeared to the people on the other side of the world and taught the same things, used the same names etc?

Although their was hundreds of years of speculation, no one actually explored until Columbus' expedition...and the rest is history.

I'm no atheist, just wondered what peoples thoughts are on this. I'm not talking about so called modern day miracles, the modern bible or peoples visions. I'm just curious as to how this can be rationalized in the context of religious teachings.

well the true and living God the HOLY one of Israel sent out men (his disciples) to do so

Mar 16:15 And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.
Mar 16:16 He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be damned.

Mat 28:18 And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.
Mat 28:19 Go ye therefore, and teach all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost:
Mat 28:20 Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and, lo, I am with you alway, even unto the end of the world. Amen.

this is the way God chose to do it
God used the children of Israel to make himself known to the world

yeah, but dat still doesn't answer my question...d mayans, incans, amerindians, american indians and countless others in the "new world" had no knowledge of the Christian God or any other that existed on that side of the world.

[megadoc1]

I did answer your question
the true and living God chose to make himself known to the world through the house of Israel

now today we have Christians living in the "new world"

[brainchild]

I did answer your question
the true and living God chose to make himself known to the world through the house of Israel

now today we have Christians living in the "new world"

Of course, but i'm talking about the thousands of years and millions of people that lived before. What is the faith of these millions in the "afterlife". If they lived without this knowledge and led happy lives, experienced tragedies, built great cities and persevered to still have descendants walking around today...why do we place so much emphasis on modern religion and its practices? Most of us walking around now are decendants of people who worshipped other things or nothing at all.

[megadoc1]

I did answer your question
the true and living God chose to make himself known to the world through the house of Israel

now today we have Christians living in the "new world"

Of course, but i'm talking about the thousands of years and millions of people that lived before. What is the faith of these millions in the "afterlife". If they lived without this knowledge and led happy lives, experienced tragedies, built great cities and persevered to still have descendants walking around today...why do we place so much emphasis on modern religion and its practices?well I don't know about the religion part (thats more like man trying to find God on his own efforts or most of the times a god to suit himself) but God wants you to know Him and this is the way he chose to do so thru Jesus christ
you can accept it or leave it, your destiny is dependent on what you choose.
how come the people who are privileged to hear Gods message are most concerned about the ones who did not hear it? somehow, most of the times they are the ones rejecting it Most of us walking around now are decendants of people who worshipped other things or nothing at all.yeah ah know but now Christ is revealed

[Duane 3NE 2NR]

brainchild, you should read through the pages of this thread (as painful as it might be) - we've been through this very discussion already

we've also come to the conclusion that megadoc1 is not open to anything other than what he already believes, so having a discussion with him is about as pointless as asking a brick for a solution for solving world hunger.

[megadoc1]

^word
so what about you duane are you open to anything other than what you already believe?

[sMASH]

that my dear friend also touches on the purpose of life, even a topic which can be discussed with atheists.

is like this, consider if god made himself known, then everyone would know who to worship, there would be no doubt there would be no atheists. every one would know the real god and the real way, and the proof of that god being the correct god, then the punishment or reward, if any would be known as well. then people would know exactly what to do. they would know if going to church on sunday is correct, if goin on saturday is correct, friday, or lighting black candles and burning chicken heads is the way which god decrees is the way to get the best he has to deliver. now that people know exactly what to do, they would do exactly that, and may not deviate and do optional stuff because doing the optional stuff my prevent them from doing the stuff they definitely sure would get them the best reward. if so, then the rest of creation would be wasted. they would be no using it, so there would be no need for it. everyone would exist and operate in their own little microcosm, never doing anything additional.
and then everyone would get the best reward, and i am using the best reward as heaven forever. then if everyone doing everything correct, and going to heaven then creating this carnal reality and placing us here for a lifetime would be purposeless and might as well have kept us in heaven, because every one already know what they have to do, and know where they are going.

in islam, (i am not saying that any one else way is way is wrong, i am saying that this is the way islam says it is and the way that i believe it to be, if u think differently then so be it) we are told that this life is a test. a test as proof to ourselves of where we going after we die, which is either heaven or hell. we have been given information, and an internal somewhat instinctual knowledge, or thinking which we would use to figure out good from bad and right from wrong and to decide what is what. we are created in this world and to use the world to do what god would like us to do. if u do it is up to u, if u don't is still up to u, ur choice. every one will have to explain all their choices and actions on judgment day. those people who realize what is a good way and still do bad, or see logic and reasoning and still refuse to accept it, would have hard time defending their selves.
we have a general guidance on how to live and treat the other creations in islam. so the world or even the universe is our play field. every action and intention would be judged, so if u wake up in the mornin u could go outside, or u could say praise god and thank him for another opportunity to do good in the world. u could farm to feed people or farm to become rich, and horde ur wealth. u could research nuclear energy to make cheap clean energy or make weapons to kill out ur neighbor. u could design space craft and explore the rest of creation god as allowed access to, or stay in ur village, just going to work and coming home, and limit ur knowledge and not make use of ur brain.

islam teaches that god knows what will happen to us, but we don't know, and we are never sure as only god decides our fate. we are to use every opportunity provided in this reality to do good to get the most reward as we are not sure how is sufficient for each individual.
the starving in africa, may be enough to share a cup of rice to gain reward in heaven, whereas the the same reward could only be achieved by building a hundred hospitals by the extremely rich.

if u sure of ur fate then this world (reality/universe) is of no use, and a waste of ur time.

[Duane 3NE 2NR]

^word
so what about you duane are you open to anything other than what you already believe?

yup - my beliefs have changed from what they were based on empirical evidence

[megadoc1]

^word
so what about you duane are you open to anything other than what you already believe?

yup - my beliefs have changed from what they were based on empirical evidence

why ? your belief wasn't strong enough the first time around ?
or was it that what you believed in wasn't true?

[Duane 3NE 2NR]

^word
so what about you duane are you open to anything other than what you already believe?

yup - my beliefs have changed from what they were based on empirical evidence

why ? your belief wasn't strong enough the first time around ?
or was it that what you believed in wasn't true?

strength in belief doesn't make something true

refer to earlier in this thread - we covered this already too

[megadoc1]

yeah I think you learned that from me lol nice nice
but now that you have put your faith in something that must
leave room for correction .
you can wake up in the morning and find out you were wrong all along,
now thats shaky ground don't you think?

[Duane 3NE 2NR]

yeah I think you learned that from me lol nice nice

no it's just plain logic

but now that you have put your faith in something that must
leave room for correction .
you can wake up in the morning and find out you were wrong all along,
now thats shaky ground don't you think?

perhaps, but it is no different from your beliefs or any one elses.

we've discussed this already in this thread - to see my point of view you can go back and read what I already wrote on it.