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Trinidad Blackout (16 Feb 2022)

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zoom rader
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Re: Trinidad Blackout (16 Feb 2022)

Postby zoom rader » May 8th, 2022, 10:22 am

kamakazi wrote:
adnj wrote:
sMASH wrote:dont get me wrong, we ARE going e... its just that there is push for it, its not based in the economics. the extraction for the chemicals to make the batteries alone is quite problematic, environmentally wise. the power for the grid will require increasing, but the most fault tolerant and flexible source is with fossil. the recylcing of the ded batteries is also problematic.
ur saving the skies, but poisoning the land. and until u get more wind and solar, its just shifting the combustion from the individual to the corporation.
ICE technology is a mature platform and has little room for improvement in cost or efficiency.

A coal-fired power plant is between 35% and 42% efficient.
A natural gas power plant is 60% efficient.
The best ICE efficiency is 25%.

Batteries are already being manufactured that improve cost, performance and environmental impact.

https://www.forbes.com/sites/enriquedan ... 0c53bd7f26



I'll keep this short as my first response didn't post

Natural gas power plant at 60%
Transmission Losses 20%
Charging your EV Losses 20%
Losses in Converting battery power to Motive Force 20%
So your EV is about 31% efficient (i am open to correction as my research might be a bit dated)


Best ICE efficiency is ~50 (F1 engines claim 52% but they don't use those daily on the streets/Diesel boat engines might get up to 60%)
In a road going vehicle the claim is up to ~ 40% (claimed by toyota and mazda) for the engine
on road Diesel ICE is up to ~45%
Transmission(Auto, CVT, Manual) losses range from ~12-30%
So some ICE vehicles are less efficient while others are more efficient than EVs

Money and Control
Tesla charges the owner for the software to operate features that are already on the car; heated seats were installed on every model up to a point in time. You can't use it even though it is equipped

Zero electric bikes does the same; the extended range feature does nothing but allow you to use more power from the same battery that is already installed on the bike with the same motor and same controller

Mercedes EQS charges a subscription fee to get an over the air update to use the full 10 degrees of rear steering. Without the sub the software limits you to 4 degrees.

Manufacturers want to control every aspect of how you use and service their cars cause they can make more money from you.
If i tell you you can only use these parts, and it can only be serviced at this dealership.
If you wake up one morning and instantly after an update your battery that used to have a range of 300kms now has a range of 30kms or limits your speed to 50kph cause the software says so. Or the software says to get your battery replaced even though it worked perfectly up to the point where you first got the message.

Could disable your airbags/abs/power steering/regen braking...etc...etc
Do you own that car or did you borrow it.

I'll keep my ICE with my simple electronics until they stop pulling this BS
I'll adjust my right foot to emit less CO2
You should have just let the jackarse bray a bit. You fed him to much infor

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Re: Trinidad Blackout (16 Feb 2022)

Postby sMASH » May 8th, 2022, 2:51 pm

cut/paste master can bring data, but no analysis or interpretation.. just another brick.

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Re: Trinidad Blackout (16 Feb 2022)

Postby zoom rader » May 8th, 2022, 3:53 pm

sMASH wrote:cut/paste master can bring data, but no analysis or interpretation.. just another brick.
He does try and have failed at every argument.

These little arseholes think they know it all by posting articles that have their own agenda.

Most of these articles that he post are written by the manufacturers .

The kant thinks solar works at night

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Re: Trinidad Blackout (16 Feb 2022)

Postby sMASH » May 8th, 2022, 6:40 pm

is men like them that does invest in things like theranos and boring company and zorce finance.
they have no real world experience in how these machines work, and their effectiveness.

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Re: Trinidad Blackout (16 Feb 2022)

Postby pugboy » May 8th, 2022, 7:05 pm

so unless the car batteries being charged by wind, solar or hydroelectric an electric car is far from zero emissions when some other fuel is used to generate the electricity for it to charge the batteries

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Re: Trinidad Blackout (16 Feb 2022)

Postby sMASH » May 8th, 2022, 7:34 pm

pugboy wrote:so unless the car batteries being charged by wind, solar or hydroelectric an electric car is far from zero emissions when some other fuel is used to generate the electricity for it to charge the batteries

over the whole life span of the vehicle... if the goal is gross co2 and nox emissions, u have to take from extraction to end of life for each route, and see which emits less.
parts of each chain is better than the others, but only if considered in isolation.

all those batteries still need to recycle after end of run and thats a whole other aspect of chemical pollution that needs to be mitigated with energy and machinery. a normal car dont have that. u can recycle the plastics or burn it for energy, the rest is a chemicals from the battery, metal and oils.

wind mills is a good idea on paper, but the variability of the wind here, on caribbean islands, will lead to a lot of stressing and u will have faster than expected life spans for those. so the cost to benefit ratio of the whole life of the windmill will be less.

what they need to do is a pilot project to get real world data on the windmills, to see if it will be over all a benefit, or fall short.
but to invest heavily all out in a wind farm, based on eupean engineer calculations... nah. been there done that... it falls short somehow... an i suspect its that they dont factor in the heat capacity of the air.

was witness to mulitple eu designed projects, that seemed worked out on paper, but did not perform well when actually implemented in trinidad.




but the main reason why we going green in trinidad, is not because it better, but because the govt getting incentive from eu to switch out. the population is being sold that it is better, but the politicians doing it cause they getting incentivized.
not all green routes are viable. some are pie in the sky.

imo,, the home solar roof incentive, should be first to get rolled out, and when that is showing up in the grid, thennnn push the ev cars.
dont push ev cars, to then put high demand on a nat gas run grid, to ahve it fall apart repeatedly, then spend a bunch of money to make up the difference hurry hurry, cause is a catastrophe... but, that is the politicians way. stupid money HAVE to pelt out to solve the catastrophe. the treasury is dem own lil piggy bank.

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Re: Trinidad Blackout (16 Feb 2022)

Postby pugboy » May 8th, 2022, 7:42 pm

that is surely the reason why, when rowlee came back from the conference the first thing he say is govt vehicles need to switch over
which is likely something all the leaders agreed on

i bet some 1% car dealer gave that in the works

sMASH wrote:but the main reason why we going green in trinidad, is not because it better, but because the govt getting incentive from eu to switch out. the population is being sold that it is better, but the politicians doing it cause they getting incentivized.
not all green routes are viable. some are pie in the sky.

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Re: Trinidad Blackout (16 Feb 2022)

Postby sMASH » May 8th, 2022, 7:56 pm

my personal pick is.... home solar roof tie-in to the grid + plug in hybrids + ev's .
we will jess burn nat gas fro 4 pm to 8 am as normal. thats 8hrs less nat gas getting combusted.
set up a wind mill some where from guyana to st lucia... to see how it performs.
and can implement a national grid battery, when a viable COST EFFECTIVE one shows up. tesla batteries good, but not cheap... for grid purposes.

prolly could incentivize tesla power walls for domestic grid applications... to throw most of the cost away from the govt.
Last edited by sMASH on May 8th, 2022, 9:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Trinidad Blackout (16 Feb 2022)

Postby pugboy » May 8th, 2022, 9:06 pm

i am curious on the lifespan of a power wall type battery system

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Re: Trinidad Blackout (16 Feb 2022)

Postby adnj » May 8th, 2022, 9:26 pm

zoom rader wrote:
sMASH wrote:cut/paste master can bring data, but no analysis or interpretation.. just another brick.
He does try and have failed at every argument.

These little arseholes think they know it all by posting articles that have their own agenda.

Most of these articles that he post are written by the manufacturers .

The kant thinks solar works at night


Here's some simple shitt for you to relate to: BEV well-to-wheel energy efficiency from a coal-fired plant is about the same as gasoline ICEV (11-27%). Adding solar, wind, or even natural gas power generation to the grid just makes BEV look better. You two dumbassholes have posted fukking nothing that comes close to proving me wrong. And unless it's some made-up hardware store/rum shop "analysis", neither of you stubborncunts can.

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Re: Trinidad Blackout (16 Feb 2022)

Postby sMASH » May 8th, 2022, 9:33 pm

rum shop talk from people who work in the industry with the machines. and have to deal with the crap that the engineers couldnt factor in.

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Re: Trinidad Blackout (16 Feb 2022)

Postby carluva » May 8th, 2022, 10:48 pm

adjn man!!!

You are a very intelligent and factual tuner, but why you like to waste your precious time so??

Watch this video till about 3:30 or so. I remember seeing this growing up and to this day, always remember this video when I see some persons who just can't let go of something and keep with the same rhetoric in all different shapes and forms.

https://youtu.be/u26z1QRnfwo

Unfortunately, these are some of the tuners on these forums. Will uselessly argue, argue, argue until everyone (or the world) moves on to better places and then still continue to uselessly argue until they cease to exist or make sense.

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Re: Trinidad Blackout (16 Feb 2022)

Postby wing » May 8th, 2022, 11:48 pm

carluva wrote:adjn man!!!

You are a very intelligent and factual tuner, but why you like to waste your precious time so??

Watch this video till about 3:30 or so. I remember seeing this growing up and to this day, always remember this video when I see some persons who just can't let go of something and keep with the same rhetoric in all different shapes and forms.

https://youtu.be/u26z1QRnfwo

Unfortunately, these are some of the tuners on these forums. Will uselessly argue, argue, argue until everyone (or the world) moves on to better places and then still continue to uselessly argue until they cease to exist or make sense.
X100000

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Re: Trinidad Blackout (16 Feb 2022)

Postby The_Honourable » May 9th, 2022, 12:29 am

jed... adjn fighting it for a long time since the covid ched. I thought he would have realized this by now but all these articles that he's filling up the cheds with although relevant not going to change the position of persons who minds right or wrong are already made up.

Over 100 pages of posts by adjn in the covid ched, hoover still here unvaccinated and safe with his government wuk. Zoom approaching 20 years here on tuner and will do another 20 easily... he willing to battle and die on the hill if that means by himself.

Not every post deserves a response, you will be burnt out. If you can't agree, sometimes you have to let persons be and move on.

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Re: Trinidad Blackout (16 Feb 2022)

Postby zoom rader » May 9th, 2022, 4:56 am

The_Honourable wrote:jed... adjn fighting it for a long time since the covid ched. I thought he would have realized this by now but all these articles that he's filling up the cheds with although relevant not going to change the position of persons who minds right or wrong are already made up.

Over 100 pages of posts by adjn in the covid ched, hoover still here unvaccinated and safe with his government wuk. Zoom approaching 20 years here on tuner and will do another 20 easily... he willing to battle and die on the hill if that means by himself.

Not every post deserves a response, you will be burnt out. If you can't agree, sometimes you have to let persons be and move on.
I won't comment on Covid not my field. However, water, oil & gas , steel and power generation was my former field.

None of these idiots have ever worked on a Solar farm. Well I have and what is written on those articles is to sell solar by the manufacturers.

I still waiting on an independent creditable article on solar for Industrial commercial production that is profitable.

Cayman Islands solar farm produces 5MW in the day during anytime from 10 to 12hrs . After 12hrs it is useless and taken offline. It is unreliable and takes up a large amount of space. Maintenance is another factor, especially in the Caribbean. Upteem grass cutting maintenance is done. If rain falls, the power drops then other generators will be put on online. If the sun is too hot, it damages the panels, and the efficiency drops. This is the reason why solar fails in hot countries. Solar is not dependable for commercial use.

However, home use is a plus .

Only idiots live in a paper world written by conmen

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Re: Trinidad Blackout (16 Feb 2022)

Postby bamfo_dennis » May 9th, 2022, 7:22 am

ah solar panel rel expenisve tho i mite take bout 10 years 2 make back dat money in saving ttec bill dat spend upfront i say nah or else i was looking but it eh good right now nah 2 hook up one 2 d roof.........maybe if dey had ah lil windmill kit so ah go get sum juice in d night

but whey d blackout report dat d comission write? wat rowlie do with it push it up he ass? ent d public was affected by d blackout n d public pay d comission ppl with tax money? whey d report ah want 2 read it.

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Re: Trinidad Blackout (16 Feb 2022)

Postby timelapse » May 9th, 2022, 8:01 am

https://thefifthestate.com.au/energy-lead/energy/nikola-tesla-dreamed-of-free-electricity-what-happened/
Interesting read here.Tesla himself,not 3l0n, despised fossil fuel dependency.The man created a working model of it,but unfortunately, big oil and big ego Edison had him put away as a madman and his work confiscated.
Another prime example of how people without vision can hinder progress because of their own lack of understanding and moreso because of their egos.Doing the same thing and expecting different results is the sign of a madman.
Zoom: Continuing on the path of fossil fuels is the same as voting for PNM.Same lack of understanding and same ego problem.

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Re: Trinidad Blackout (16 Feb 2022)

Postby zoom rader » May 9th, 2022, 8:27 am

timelapse wrote:https://thefifthestate.com.au/energy-lead/energy/nikola-tesla-dreamed-of-free-electricity-what-happened/
Interesting read here.Tesla himself,not 3l0n, despised fossil fuel dependency.The man created a working model of it,but unfortunately, big oil and big ego Edison had him put away as a madman and his work confiscated.
Another prime example of how people without vision can hinder progress because of their own lack of understanding and moreso because of their egos.Doing the same thing and expecting different results is the sign of a madman.
Zoom: Continuing on the path of fossil fuels is the same as voting for PNM.Same lack of understanding and same ego problem.
Hoss, I am not a fan of fossil fuel, but lots of lies and manipulations are being told on Solar just to sell it on the commercial side.

People want clean energy, then hydro has proven itself.

Windfarms are break-even operations

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Re: Trinidad Blackout (16 Feb 2022)

Postby timelapse » May 9th, 2022, 8:41 am

zoom rader wrote:
timelapse wrote:https://thefifthestate.com.au/energy-lead/energy/nikola-tesla-dreamed-of-free-electricity-what-happened/
Interesting read here.Tesla himself,not 3l0n, despised fossil fuel dependency.The man created a working model of it,but unfortunately, big oil and big ego Edison had him put away as a madman and his work confiscated.
Another prime example of how people without vision can hinder progress because of their own lack of understanding and moreso because of their egos.Doing the same thing and expecting different results is the sign of a madman.
Zoom: Continuing on the path of fossil fuels is the same as voting for PNM.Same lack of understanding and same ego problem.
Hoss, I am not a fan of fossil fuel, but lots of lies and manipulations are being told on Solar just to sell it on the commercial side.

People want clean energy, then hydro has proven itself.

Windfarms are break-even operations
It didn't appear so before.But now that you cleared that up,no problem.What do you think of the Nikola Tesla model? Minus the propaganda?I know there will be initial startup costs and maintenance costs, plastic, cooling oils etc. if any ...
We already have 5g out in the world, do you think wireless,'free' electricity would work?

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Re: Trinidad Blackout (16 Feb 2022)

Postby zoom rader » May 9th, 2022, 10:40 am

timelapse wrote:
zoom rader wrote:
timelapse wrote:https://thefifthestate.com.au/energy-lead/energy/nikola-tesla-dreamed-of-free-electricity-what-happened/
Interesting read here.Tesla himself,not 3l0n, despised fossil fuel dependency.The man created a working model of it,but unfortunately, big oil and big ego Edison had him put away as a madman and his work confiscated.
Another prime example of how people without vision can hinder progress because of their own lack of understanding and moreso because of their egos.Doing the same thing and expecting different results is the sign of a madman.
Zoom: Continuing on the path of fossil fuels is the same as voting for PNM.Same lack of understanding and same ego problem.
Hoss, I am not a fan of fossil fuel, but lots of lies and manipulations are being told on Solar just to sell it on the commercial side.

People want clean energy, then hydro has proven itself.

Windfarms are break-even operations
It didn't appear so before.But now that you cleared that up,no problem.What do you think of the Nikola Tesla model? Minus the propaganda?I know there will be initial startup costs and maintenance costs, plastic, cooling oils etc. if any ...
We already have 5g out in the world, do you think wireless,'free' electricity would work?
Only Tesla techs can work on ur kart.

If u get harrylal to work on it, u on ur own.

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Re: Trinidad Blackout (16 Feb 2022)

Postby timelapse » May 9th, 2022, 10:43 am

zoom rader wrote:
timelapse wrote:
zoom rader wrote:
timelapse wrote:https://thefifthestate.com.au/energy-lead/energy/nikola-tesla-dreamed-of-free-electricity-what-happened/
Interesting read here.Tesla himself,not 3l0n, despised fossil fuel dependency.The man created a working model of it,but unfortunately, big oil and big ego Edison had him put away as a madman and his work confiscated.
Another prime example of how people without vision can hinder progress because of their own lack of understanding and moreso because of their egos.Doing the same thing and expecting different results is the sign of a madman.
Zoom: Continuing on the path of fossil fuels is the same as voting for PNM.Same lack of understanding and same ego problem.
Hoss, I am not a fan of fossil fuel, but lots of lies and manipulations are being told on Solar just to sell it on the commercial side.

People want clean energy, then hydro has proven itself.

Windfarms are break-even operations
It didn't appear so before.But now that you cleared that up,no problem.What do you think of the Nikola Tesla model? Minus the propaganda?I know there will be initial startup costs and maintenance costs, plastic, cooling oils etc. if any ...
We already have 5g out in the world, do you think wireless,'free' electricity would work?
Only Tesla techs can work on ur kart.

If u get harrylal to work on it, u on ur own.
Read what I asked again.Not the EV.Electricity in general.I linked a whole article there

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Re: Trinidad Blackout (16 Feb 2022)

Postby wing » May 9th, 2022, 11:58 am

Why do some users refer to electric vehicles as karts? Is it because they are only aware of animal drawn karts and are still stuck in the 1800s?

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Re: Trinidad Blackout (16 Feb 2022)

Postby sMASH » May 9th, 2022, 5:41 pm

That's cause when the ass tired he hadde rest and recharge for 8 hrs for wuk d next day.

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Re: Trinidad Blackout (16 Feb 2022)

Postby zoom rader » May 9th, 2022, 7:56 pm

sMASH wrote:That's cause when the ass tired he hadde rest and recharge for 8 hrs for wuk d next day.
In a nutshell that's what they are .

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Re: Trinidad Blackout (16 Feb 2022)

Postby matix » May 9th, 2022, 8:41 pm


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Re: Trinidad Blackout (16 Feb 2022)

Postby zoom rader » May 10th, 2022, 2:32 am

matix wrote:https://youtu.be/DG9Izqp6WWU
The con is real and idiots don't understand why it's called a kart.

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Re: Trinidad Blackout (16 Feb 2022)

Postby wing » May 10th, 2022, 3:57 am

zoom rader wrote:
matix wrote:https://youtu.be/DG9Izqp6WWU
The con is real and idiots don't understand why it's called a kart.
Ok so kart is meant as a derogatory term for electric vehicles, or are persons still under the impression that only animal drawn or golf karts exist? Then there are go karts which are mostly engine powered. Then again, most electric vehicles are constructed like a go kart with batteries in the floor, so kart can be used as a description I think. I wonder if people still refer to cars as horseless carriages in the same way as they refer to electric vehicles as karts.

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Re: Trinidad Blackout (16 Feb 2022)

Postby Supra GT-FOUR » May 10th, 2022, 5:08 am

Golf karts are battery powered

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Re: Trinidad Blackout (16 Feb 2022)

Postby wing » May 10th, 2022, 5:34 am

It's all semantics, I really shouldn't waste my time with names and descriptions and the rantings of rumshop intellectuals.

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Re: Trinidad Blackout (16 Feb 2022)

Postby zoom rader » May 10th, 2022, 8:30 am

wing wrote:
zoom rader wrote:
matix wrote:https://youtu.be/DG9Izqp6WWU
The con is real and idiots don't understand why it's called a kart.
Ok so kart is meant as a derogatory term for electric vehicles, or are persons still under the impression that only animal drawn or golf karts exist? Then there are go karts which are mostly engine powered. Then again, most electric vehicles are constructed like a go kart with batteries in the floor, so kart can be used as a description I think. I wonder if people still refer to cars as horseless carriages in the same way as they refer to electric vehicles as karts.
The kart came before the car

Electric Karts are about 150years old with popularity around 1890.

In the UK the local milk door to door supply was all electric karts. In the UK they are known as milk karts or floats.

In the 1960s the UK had the most electric karts on the road in the world.

They are call karts because the batteries sit low in the fame.

The model manufacturers are the ones that are trying to use the word car or electric vehicles to play mind games on the public.

Would u sell a Car or a Kart ?

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