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caroni sugar production can it be done again

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Redman
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Re: caroni sugar production can it be done again

Postby Redman » November 23rd, 2019, 8:30 am

rspann wrote:Anybody knows our sugar import bill per annum? I've always wondered why sugar and rice couldnt be continued to be produced here and save some of that foreign exchange. Guyana does it still and I've seen large estates in Florida producing for the US


This is inconvenient truth to many....but it is first hand info.

The cane farming industry-and lands,plant and machinery could have been part of a viable world class biz as of 2010.
Cane could be used for Sugar,Ethanol and in 2010 paper-subject to efficiencies etc

The choice was made to lease the crushing plant etc to a financier,2010
Effectively killing the re birth/redirect of Cane farmers

That the financier imports sugar -is coincidental :|
As is the bed and breakfast services provided to political leaders.

Gopaul luck aint Seepaul luck.
Last edited by Redman on November 23rd, 2019, 8:38 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: caroni sugar production can it be done again

Postby sMASH » November 23rd, 2019, 8:32 am

no. unless we can market it as some unique kinda sugar, like the moruga hill rice, so u can charge a higher than normal price. or probably just for local supply it might work,

31 ton of cane can be produced per acre
and 220lbs sugar can be extracted per ton of sugar cane. that is like 100kg

2010 we imported 84,000 tons. that was a high, but will use that, to say, we might export some to like badoes or grenada or sumting.


84,000 / 0.1 = 840000 tons of sugar cane is needed to produce 84000 tons of sugar,
840000/31 = 27,100 acres of land is needed to produce 84ktons of sugar.
so that is like 109 sq kilometers.

when u look at a trinidad map, and see how much 10kmsq, occupies, is quite a lot.

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Re: caroni sugar production can it be done again

Postby MaxPower » November 23rd, 2019, 8:40 am

People studying weed atm

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Re: caroni sugar production can it be done again

Postby Dizzy28 » November 23rd, 2019, 9:01 am

rspann wrote:Anybody knows our sugar import bill per annum? I've always wondered why sugar and rice couldnt be continued to be produced here and save some of that foreign exchange. Guyana does it still and I've seen large estates in Florida producing for the US
300,000 tonnes annually or something like that.....but think that refined and raw sugar combined. Refined is not white sugar btw and is the one used in food and beverage manufacturing.

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Re: caroni sugar production can it be done again

Postby VexXx Dogg » November 23rd, 2019, 10:15 am

MaxPower wrote:People studying weed atm
Convert caroni cane land for some filthy douglarized strains of buds. For export.

10000000000% increase in praedial larceny.

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Re: caroni sugar production can it be done again

Postby zoom rader » November 23rd, 2019, 11:07 am

vaiostation wrote:Rowley: We were not racist on Caroni

Rowley: We were not racist on Caroni
THE Prime Minister has strongly denied the PNM was racist for having closed Caroni (1975) Ltd in 2003 under the Patrick Manning administration.

He was addressing a PNM rally at La Horquetta Regional Complex on Thursday. He said such an allegation had been made by someone amid the outpouring of accolades at the recent death of Sanatan Dharma Maha Sabha head Satnarayan Maharaj.

Dr Rowley said in 1975 a PNM government had bought sugar estates from owners keen to sell and had then run the industry for 20 years buoyed by preferential prices in the United States and Europe.

However, this overseas support was ended by the World Trade Organisation, leading to the closure of Caroni, as sugar estates also shut in St Kitts, Antigua and Jamaica, none of which countries were accused of racism.

“Yet only last week I had to read the Caroni closure was due to racism,” said an exasperated Rowley.

He recalled the Government had spent $9 billion in Caroni’s closure on things such as providing benefits to ex-workers.

Rowley hit the media for their uncritical reporting on the issue, including the Opposition’s plans to restart the local sugar cane industry.

“What really galls me is, the media will just print that without any challenge,” he said.

The PM recalled how the Government had tried to keep the economy steady, resisting calls to trim the budget.

He said, “Some of you might not have made it.”
He criticised individuals he had recently met who were demanding he give them “more, more, more,” as he replied that you cannot get more from less.

Saying the Energy Minister smiles at everything, the PM said Franklin Khan’s recent news that TT has just ten years of natural gas reserves left now means it will run out before the SEA exam date of a baby born today, unless new gas deposits are found.

“You don’t know what we’ve been through,” Rowley said of the challenges of governance.

https://newsday.co.tt/2019/11/22/rowley ... aZOkVpWPt8
Total Bull5hit

Is was all racist

There was an Indian buyer for the industry from India but PNM blanked them. Appears that PNM wanted no more Indians coming here and keeping Indians employed.

Only those that worked in Caroni would know that tradesmen in the factory was almost even proportion of Afros and Indos while cutters were almost injuns.

To say that Caroni was pure indos is total bull5hit.

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Re: caroni sugar production can it be done again

Postby Phone Surgeon » November 23rd, 2019, 11:35 am

Zoom you throw in your hat to take over the Maha Sabha by chance?

I think you would make a great candidate to replace sat

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Re: caroni sugar production can it be done again

Postby zoom rader » November 23rd, 2019, 11:54 am

Phone Surgeon wrote:Zoom you throw in your hat to take over the Maha Sabha by chance?

I think you would make a great candidate to replace sat
I not Hindu bro.

But I support anyone that stands up and fights against discrimination.

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Re: caroni sugar production can it be done again

Postby ek4ever » November 23rd, 2019, 12:30 pm

Caroni became unprofitable a large part due to how it was run..... same as Petrotrin. A profitable sugar industry can lead to downstream investments in other products. Unfortunately this country is run by fools who cannot put country before party

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Re: caroni sugar production can it be done again

Postby zoom rader » November 23rd, 2019, 1:19 pm

ek4ever wrote:Caroni became unprofitable a large part due to how it was run..... same as Petrotrin. A profitable sugar industry can lead to downstream investments in other products. Unfortunately this country is run by fools who cannot put country before party
Caroni was allow to be a run away horse in order to shut it down. This was the directives when Manning first became PM in 1991.

Eric Williams saved caroni workers in 1975 when goverment brought the plant, other wise workers would have lost their jobs.

In one hand PNM saved workers and in the other they got rid of workers.

The only reason to get rid of caroni was to break Indos and keep them in place. At that time PNM thought Indos grew to fast when it came to votes, education and employment . That failed fast.

You must remember when caroni was close the PNM opened the new sugar manufacturing company and they put ppl in charge who knew nothing about the sugar industry. That also failed fast and went bust
Last edited by zoom rader on November 23rd, 2019, 1:19 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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Re: caroni sugar production can it be done again

Postby one eye » November 23rd, 2019, 1:19 pm

Why do we need sugar production when we can import it? That is backward thinking. We need to focus on more important things like housing projects and health care.

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Re: caroni sugar production can it be done again

Postby rspann » November 23rd, 2019, 1:21 pm

one eye wrote:Why do we need sugar production when we can import it? That is backward thinking. We need to focus on more important things like housing projects and health care.



Import it with scarce forex. Sense.

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Re: caroni sugar production can it be done again

Postby zoom rader » November 23rd, 2019, 1:24 pm

one eye wrote:Why do we need sugar production when we can import it? That is backward thinking. We need to focus on more important things like housing projects and health care.
Housing and health care does not bring in foreign excange.

Caroni brought in US dollar's by selling sugar and paid workers in TT.

It was a hoax that Caroni was not profitable.

Foreign exchange was lost when caroni was sold

Also remember caroni sold Oranges and buffolipso

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Re: caroni sugar production can it be done again

Postby RedVEVO » November 23rd, 2019, 2:57 pm

^^

Caroni workers worked ..

It was management that wanted all the sweetest .

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Re: caroni sugar production can it be done again

Postby matr1x » November 23rd, 2019, 4:53 pm

Caroni workers worked.


Pnm ppl scratch their cyat

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Re: caroni sugar production can it be done again

Postby Rovin » November 23rd, 2019, 6:42 pm

it have anything govt has its hands in that making a profit ? , probably not since all govts know how to do is mismanage , teef then shut it down & send ppl home to ketch dmc

T&T has climate & land to grow almost anything [even apple & grapes remember d news where a local farmer did it] , we cud do anything here but d politics is in every damn ting ......

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Re: caroni sugar production can it be done again

Postby ek4ever » November 23rd, 2019, 7:25 pm

Rovin wrote:it have anything govt has its hands in that making a profit ? , probably not since all govts know how to do is mismanage , teef then shut it down & send ppl home to ketch dmc

T&T has climate & land to grow almost anything [even apple & grapes remember d news where a local farmer did it] , we cud do anything here but d politics is in every damn ting ......
This!

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Re: caroni sugar production can it be done again

Postby rspann » November 23rd, 2019, 7:30 pm

Redman wrote:
rspann wrote:Anybody knows our sugar import bill per annum? I've always wondered why sugar and rice couldnt be continued to be produced here and save some of that foreign exchange. Guyana does it still and I've seen large estates in Florida producing for the US


This is inconvenient truth to many....but it is first hand info.

The cane farming industry-and lands,plant and machinery could have been part of a viable world class biz as of 2010.
Cane could be used for Sugar,Ethanol and in 2010 paper-subject to efficiencies etc

The choice was made to lease the crushing plant etc to a financier,2010
Effectively killing the re birth/redirect of Cane farmers

That the financier imports sugar -is coincidental :|
As is the bed and breakfast services provided to political leaders.

Gopaul luck aint Seepaul luck.



If I get half of Gopaul luck, I good to go.

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Re: caroni sugar production can it be done again

Postby EFFECTIC DESIGNS » November 24th, 2019, 1:53 pm

Most of the so called Demerara "gold" sold in this country does be repackaged burst brown sugar with rat piss and all kinda assness. I used to work for a company that distributed sugar, what I have seen regarding burst sugar being repackaged simply cannot be unseen.

In any event how Trinidad competing with Guyana? I honestly do believe if Sugar had money, Rowley would have been on that train already. The whole racism thing is a UNC talking point bunch of crap, that sugar industry closed down because of a bunch of thief. Even Panday said how they used to over weigh the cane and how is the same Indian self who thief out the money. He say how they were lazy and running racket so I have no idea how the whole race thing came into effect with Caroni.

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Re: caroni sugar production can it be done again

Postby zoom rader » November 24th, 2019, 2:23 pm

EFFECTIC DESIGNS wrote:Most of the so called Demerara "gold" sold in this country does be repackaged burst brown sugar with rat piss and all kinda assness. I used to work for a company that distributed sugar, what I have seen regarding burst sugar being repackaged simply cannot be unseen.

In any event how Trinidad competing with Guyana? I honestly do believe if Sugar had money, Rowley would have been on that train already. The whole racism thing is a UNC talking point bunch of crap, that sugar industry closed down because of a bunch of thief. Even Panday said how they used to over weigh the cane and how is the same Indian self who thief out the money. He say how they were lazy and running racket so I have no idea how the whole race thing came into effect with Caroni.
Caroni was not only sugar bro they produced white sugar, fruits, meats and skilled trademens. They also refined imported sugar from Cuba

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Re: caroni sugar production can it be done again

Postby EFFECTIC DESIGNS » November 24th, 2019, 2:38 pm

zoom rader wrote:
EFFECTIC DESIGNS wrote:Most of the so called Demerara "gold" sold in this country does be repackaged burst brown sugar with rat piss and all kinda assness. I used to work for a company that distributed sugar, what I have seen regarding burst sugar being repackaged simply cannot be unseen.

In any event how Trinidad competing with Guyana? I honestly do believe if Sugar had money, Rowley would have been on that train already. The whole racism thing is a UNC talking point bunch of crap, that sugar industry closed down because of a bunch of thief. Even Panday said how they used to over weigh the cane and how is the same Indian self who thief out the money. He say how they were lazy and running racket so I have no idea how the whole race thing came into effect with Caroni.
Caroni was not only sugar bro they produced white sugar, fruits, meats and skilled trademens. They also refined imported sugar from Cuba


Very interesting I didn't know this, I learn something today

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Re: caroni sugar production can it be done again

Postby zoom rader » November 24th, 2019, 2:48 pm

EFFECTIC DESIGNS wrote:
zoom rader wrote:
EFFECTIC DESIGNS wrote:Most of the so called Demerara "gold" sold in this country does be repackaged burst brown sugar with rat piss and all kinda assness. I used to work for a company that distributed sugar, what I have seen regarding burst sugar being repackaged simply cannot be unseen.

In any event how Trinidad competing with Guyana? I honestly do believe if Sugar had money, Rowley would have been on that train already. The whole racism thing is a UNC talking point bunch of crap, that sugar industry closed down because of a bunch of thief. Even Panday said how they used to over weigh the cane and how is the same Indian self who thief out the money. He say how they were lazy and running racket so I have no idea how the whole race thing came into effect with Caroni.
Caroni was not only sugar bro they produced white sugar, fruits, meats and skilled trademens. They also refined imported sugar from Cuba


Very interesting I didn't know this, I learn something today
Anyone who worked Caroni will tell you this.

The best trademens came from caroni. Their apprenticeship program was like gold standard. No UWI or Utt grads they were hands on and most sort after Technicians. In effect they had one of the best trade schools long before San Fernando tech , MIC , Utt.

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Re: caroni sugar production can it be done again

Postby Redman » November 24th, 2019, 6:57 pm

Raffique has a pretty good synopsis of Caroni s closure in todays Express.

Oddly at odds with much that was spewed above.

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Re: caroni sugar production can it be done again

Postby rspann » November 24th, 2019, 7:50 pm

The article answered my question, $300m. It also tells of the losses over the years that had to be absorbed by the state and the debt that had to be written off. So it was not profitable at all. Seems like it's just another political football.

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Re: caroni sugar production can it be done again

Postby zoom rader » November 24th, 2019, 9:09 pm

rspann wrote:The article answered my question, $300m. It also tells of the losses over the years that had to be absorbed by the state and the debt that had to be written off. So it was not profitable at all. Seems like it's just another political football.
Remember Eric William brought Caroni in 1975 to Save workers.

Also note that Caroni brought in US and paid worker in TT.

Caroni did make money but it was grossly mis-managed and lots of Stealing took place. Cost to buy stuff is where they lost money.

Caroni would buy new Land Rovers and the workers would swap out the parts with old parts.

In the machine shop they would turn out stuff for home use on company time.

The weighting of cane was a con job.

With all this Caroni was a low paying job for tradesmen. In 1985 a low tradesmen would make $150 per week.

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Re: caroni sugar production can it be done again

Postby The_Honourable » March 6th, 2020, 11:15 am

Sugar mills to be demolished

The Usine Ste Madeleine and Brechin Castle sugar mills are about to be demolished.

This is the claim of the TT Scrap Iron Dealers Association, which, in a letter to the Minister of Agriculture, urged that its members should be given preference in clearing away the scrap iron which would result from the demolition.

The association, which represents 125 individual scrap dealers, wrote to Minister of Agriculture Clarence Rambharat to express concern that there may have been a preferred bidder in the tendering process to clear the rubble and the pre-qualification process in the removal would was more stringent than required.

“Each operator must be licensed based on the present policy," the association said. "The dealer is also mandated to have his or her licence renewed on an annual basis. Failure to comply is tantamount to be declared in breach of the Old Metal and Marine Stores Act, Chapter 84:07.”

The letter also said the recognition of the association came out of “painstaking discussions” between the Ministry of Trade and Industry and the association, and in those discussions it was stipulated that no foreign operators should do business in the scrap iron industry without a licence issued by the magistrates court.

The association called for a meeting with the minister.

Source: http://newsday.co.tt/2020/03/05/sugar-m ... emolished/

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Re: caroni sugar production can it be done again

Postby De Dragon » March 6th, 2020, 10:12 pm

^^ Maybe the PNM is clearing the way for a new sugar mill? :lol: :lol:
Seriously though, you'd think that a commodity like sugar which will be used until everyone on this forum dies, would have been a no-brainer.

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Re: caroni sugar production can it be done again

Postby zoom rader » March 6th, 2020, 11:06 pm

De Dragon wrote:^^ Maybe the PNM is clearing the way for a new sugar mill?
Seriously though, you'd think that a commodity like sugar which will be used until everyone on this forum dies, would have been a no-brainer.
Rumour has it , its a new housing site for PNM ghetto folk .

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Re: caroni sugar production can it be done again

Postby Ben_spanna » March 7th, 2020, 8:03 am

Given the current food supplies in the world and the issues with viruses, and impending shortages of essential foods, :mrgreen: we might very well need to start back growing as much as we can to survive, I wish politicians would pull their heads out of the falsely pRoud a55es and understand that concept.

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Re: caroni sugar production can it be done again

Postby ruffneck_12 » March 7th, 2020, 6:50 pm

Trinidad is the fattest island in the caribbean


so why we doh make we own sugar seeing that we consume so much of it?

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