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Numb3r4 wrote:Work 'til you die unless you die working first.
Good luck guys....
Politics came into play and politicians needed votes so fiscal responsibility and feasibility went through the window. Paying actuaries top dollar and neglecting any advice they giveNumb3r4 wrote:In general though our pensions seem to be a bit to much am I right in having this view?
$3000.00 as a pension?? Isn't the minimum wage $3000.00 how is it you "earn" the same as a worker and as a pensioner?
One person is bringing in economic value and the other person isn't at this time, they did at one point but not now.
Shouldn't the pension be a fraction of the minimum wage, I knew a rule of thumb that stated that in retirement you should adjust your lifestyle to be funded on 60% (some say 66%) of your monthly wage that you once worked for. I don't expect the gov't to work like that but...
Numb3r4 wrote:In general though our pensions seem to be a bit to much am I right in having this view?
$3000.00 as a pension?? Isn't the minimum wage $3000.00 how is it you "earn" the same as a worker and as a pensioner?
One person is bringing in economic value and the other person isn't at this time, they did at one point but not now.
Shouldn't the pension be a fraction of the minimum wage, I knew a rule of thumb that stated that in retirement you should adjust your lifestyle to be funded on 60% (some say 66%) of your monthly wage that you once worked for. I don't expect the gov't to work like that but...
88sins wrote:Numb3r4 wrote:In general though our pensions seem to be a bit to much am I right in having this view?
$3000.00 as a pension?? Isn't the minimum wage $3000.00 how is it you "earn" the same as a worker and as a pensioner?
One person is bringing in economic value and the other person isn't at this time, they did at one point but not now.
Shouldn't the pension be a fraction of the minimum wage, I knew a rule of thumb that stated that in retirement you should adjust your lifestyle to be funded on 60% (some say 66%) of your monthly wage that you once worked for. I don't expect the gov't to work like that but...
So, you have zero problem discounting the contributions that the retiree has made to the economy throughout their working years, and want them to live on 2/3 of minimum wage.
Lemme enlighten you a bit.
With aging, comes health conditions. Now, say a person in their old age has a heart attack and survives. After leaving hospital they will probably be put on meds. You have any clue about the cost of the medicine that person has to take, for the rest of their life?
Low dose aspirin- about $18/bottle
Anti-platelet meds- about $15/tablet, for the generics, that's $450/month
Anti-cholesterol meds- about $30/tablet for the generics, that's about $900/month
And probably additional drugs for hypertension, diabetes, etc.
So, with 2 meds alone, almost half the pension spent. And you want them to live on less than $3000. Good to know.
I hope when your time comes, you tell them that you only want $2000 or less and that you have to adjust your lifestyle accordingly.
Numero,Numb3r4 wrote:88sins wrote:Numb3r4 wrote:In general though our pensions seem to be a bit to much am I right in having this view?
$3000.00 as a pension?? Isn't the minimum wage $3000.00 how is it you "earn" the same as a worker and as a pensioner?
One person is bringing in economic value and the other person isn't at this time, they did at one point but not now.
Shouldn't the pension be a fraction of the minimum wage, I knew a rule of thumb that stated that in retirement you should adjust your lifestyle to be funded on 60% (some say 66%) of your monthly wage that you once worked for. I don't expect the gov't to work like that but...
So, you have zero problem discounting the contributions that the retiree has made to the economy throughout their working years, and want them to live on 2/3 of minimum wage.
Lemme enlighten you a bit.
With aging, comes health conditions. Now, say a person in their old age has a heart attack and survives. After leaving hospital they will probably be put on meds. You have any clue about the cost of the medicine that person has to take, for the rest of their life?
Low dose aspirin- about $18/bottle
Anti-platelet meds- about $15/tablet, for the generics, that's $450/month
Anti-cholesterol meds- about $30/tablet for the generics, that's about $900/month
And probably additional drugs for hypertension, diabetes, etc.
So, with 2 meds alone, almost half the pension spent. And you want them to live on less than $3000. Good to know.
I hope when your time comes, you tell them that you only want $2000 or less and that you have to adjust your lifestyle accordingly.
I'm not dis-counting the contributions, but if you paid for x years then you should only get back x years worth of contributions unless we sign onto like an investment plan where we are aware of the expected rate of return so the capital can grow like how the bank will package a financial plan, so if I make 30yrs contributions then I can only expect it to pay me for 30yrs in retirement. Thus it would make the fund more sustainable if they didn't dispense the maximum every month and then come 30yrs later persons are living longer and, and now they have NO MONEY when they are 30yrs OLDER. Had we been dispensing a smaller more manageable sum we might have still had money to dispense.
Your health is your responsibility first an foremost, much of our health problems in TnT are based around lifestyle, but not all folks have them, so sometime when it come to funding health care you ultimately have the well who lived a little better funding those who did (or could) not. This only encourages the excess as folks feel "wen ah retiah ah go study dat....now I hadda enjoy mehself", and as a nation we did enjoy ourselves.
If we truly cared about the pricing of medications and the cost of health care the public health care system would have been better run and funded. Not to mention give folks alternative health care options like community Yoga and improving access to parks and recreational facilities it might not seem like a lot up front but for those who are committed the cumulative effects to your health are real and tangible.
Your point about health and the cost of medications only goes to prove further failure when it comes to the health infrastructure. SO now we have 2 (NIS & health and hospitals) institutions that are set up to deliver health care and both are struggling. Again proving that the existing way that the NIS was handled was wrong and should not have been.
Maybe if folks were given less they would have been more aware of how expensive medications are and better planned their lives.
With regards to minimum wage or wages in general is it not that you are paid a wage based on the work that you are doing that is the specific skillset that you bring to the labour market, whether it is labourer or neurosurgeon, when you are no longer adding that skill to the market how can you expect to be compensated at that exact level?
If you wish to be then continue working or invest in yourself and put in place an annuity or just plain save.
Defending the NIS in its current state (to me) seems like defending the dependency syndrome inducing CEPEP work schemes, it amounts to roughly the same thing, we refuse to admit that we need adjustment to our lifestyles at a core level. For a long time we just used the NIS to prop up a lifestyle that was just plain unsustainable and now we no longer have the $3,000.00 to keep reality out.
That's the reason the system was created in the first place because ppl were not saving didn't even have money to bury themselves if they died and it was a financial burden on their families. Who working minimum wage really gonna save money for their retirement ? The system has to remain mandatory so that less fortunate can get relief , it's called social security for a reason.DMan7 wrote:Allya beating up about this too much. Just get rid of NIS and pension and let people save their own money when they young for when they reach retirement age.
hover11 wrote:
Dependency syndrome is how trinis thrive....imagine even if you don't make the 750 contributions you are entitled to a grant of THREE times what you put into the system so many ppl leave with substantial lumpsum payments and still seek assistance from social welfare afterwards. Where else in the world can you do that.
pugboy wrote:all them unions complaining about the low offers but they dont talk about how they already have sweet pension deals all along regardless of 0% or whatever
Sins,88sins wrote:pugboy wrote:all them unions complaining about the low offers but they dont talk about how they already have sweet pension deals all along regardless of 0% or whatever
Of course they don't
You feel they gonna explain to members that their dues being used to pay for luxury cars, overseas vacations, private pensions, and to support their lifestyle? That eh gonna go over well with the membership, when a man loss he wuk and can't feed his family but have to pay dues for a union jackass to use said dues to live large.
Allyuh feel unions in trinidad is a scam in joke.
Imagine, you paying dues for at a rate of $100/month for 20 years, and if you go to them and they have to take legal action against your employer on your behalf they telling you outright that they want 30-50% of the judgment should you win your case. And they intentionally gonna do all they can to drag that case out for YEARS, because every month that goes by you have to pay them dues.
hover11 wrote:Sins,
Don't we pay for car insurance and home insurance for years and in the event anything occurs do we get back anything? These entitles simply pocket our premiums, however, it is better to have insurance and be a member of a union in the event that something occurs. Suppose , that you were unfairly dismissed and you were not a member of a union , you would have to pay an outrageous amount just for them to hear your case or seek a lawyer to take up the matter as a high court matter.
In these times, 100 dollars is next to nothing , I don't even miss that coming out my salary. It is better to have peace of mind in case anything occurs.
hover11 wrote:Sins,88sins wrote:pugboy wrote:all them unions complaining about the low offers but they dont talk about how they already have sweet pension deals all along regardless of 0% or whatever
Of course they don't
You feel they gonna explain to members that their dues being used to pay for luxury cars, overseas vacations, private pensions, and to support their lifestyle? That eh gonna go over well with the membership, when a man loss he wuk and can't feed his family but have to pay dues for a union jackass to use said dues to live large.
Allyuh feel unions in trinidad is a scam in joke.
Imagine, you paying dues for at a rate of $100/month for 20 years, and if you go to them and they have to take legal action against your employer on your behalf they telling you outright that they want 30-50% of the judgment should you win your case. And they intentionally gonna do all they can to drag that case out for YEARS, because every month that goes by you have to pay them dues.
Don't we pay for car insurance and home insurance for years and in the event anything occurs do we get back anything? These entitles simply pocket our premiums, however, it is better to have insurance and be a member of a union in the event that something occurs. Suppose , that you were unfairly dismissed and you were not a member of a union , you would have to pay an outrageous amount just for them to hear your case or seek a lawyer to take up the matter as a high court matter.
In these times, 100 dollars is next to nothing , I don't even miss that coming out my salary. It is better to have peace of mind in case anything occurs.
death365 wrote:So that's it .... 9 days pass so trinis move on already from the fact that the government said the will be moving the retirement age to 65.
That's a trap cause the system is now designed for u to pay more bills and taxes. So when a person gets to 60 and they see that they don't have enough to live on, they will have to continue working.Dizzy28 wrote:As Colm said you can still retire earlier. The people this affects are those who will depend solely on NIS for a pension
Those with private pensions will more than likely be unaffected.death365 wrote:So that's it .... 9 days pass so trinis move on already from the fact that the government said the will be moving the retirement age to 65.
shaneelal wrote:https://trinidadexpress.com/business/lo ... 673fd.html
What does this mean?
To sum it up, this simply means that there is now no guarantee that upon retirement, one will receive his “pension” that he would have contributed to throughout his entire working life.
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