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NIB Deficiting ON u

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How do you feel about NIB Deficiting on u

Good
1
5%
Not good
13
68%
I like to be deficited on
5
26%
 
Total votes: 19

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paid_influencer
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NIB Deficiting ON u

Postby paid_influencer » February 9th, 2022, 10:32 pm

deficiting.jpg

https://www.facebook.com/tttliveonline/ ... 6262875610

NIB Executive Director: Urgent Reform Needed
February 9, 2022
Kimberly De Souza

The National Insurance Board (NIB) has revealed that its contribution income is no longer sufficient to support its benefit payments, which has resulted in a deficit for the company.

Executive Director of the NIB, Niala Persad-Poliah, said the benefit expenditure has been growing because of the ageing population and people leading healthier lifestyles.

She said between the period 2017 to 2020, benefit expenditure grew from $4.7 billion to $5.3 billion. But, during the same period, contribution income hovered between $4.7 and $4.6 billion.

Mrs. Persad-Poliah said the trend is expected to continue into the future. While the fund is sustainable, she said urgent reform is needed.

Mrs. Persad-Poliah said another suggestion is to freeze the minimum pension until it becomes relevant. She revealed that NIB met with the Ministry of Finance on the matter.


In the video, the suggestion is to raise retirement age to 65 (already in progress), and to raise the price of NIB contributions (from 13.2% to 16%).

so how do u feel about NIB deficiting on u?

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Re: NIB Deficiting ON u

Postby hover11 » February 9th, 2022, 10:39 pm

About time we cannot keep spending more than we are earning time to raise contributions and raise that retirement age. Also some of those benefits need to go. Start running it like a business and not a rum shop

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Re: NIB Deficiting ON u

Postby paid_influencer » February 9th, 2022, 10:42 pm

for a variety of reasons, I will probably not live to 65. I would like a way to get out of NIB, since I will not live long enough to collect. All the NIB fees from my earnings going to pay retirement for people that lived in the boom times when money was flowing and incomes phat. They had opportunities that me and my children can't dream of having now. And none of the "contributions" from my limited income will be left when I need it. It farking sucks and feels like like being defecated upon.

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Re: NIB Deficiting ON u

Postby hover11 » February 9th, 2022, 10:48 pm

paid_influencer wrote:for a variety of reasons, I will probably not live to 65. I would like a way to get out of NIB, since I will not live long enough to collect. All the NIB fees from my earnings going to pay retirement for people that lived in the boom times when money was flowing and incomes phat. They had opportunities that me and my children can't dream of having now. And none of the "contributions" from my limited income will be left when I need it. It farking sucks and feels like like being defecated upon.
Paid influencer question for you do you find it fair someone who only worked a year and had 9 children (service man) that the nib has to pay for those children up to the age of 19. I understand where you coming from you want to get some benefit of the money you putting in but the point I trying to make is this is the Government’s ponzi scheme. How many ppl die at 59 and never claimed in their lives?

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Re: NIB Deficiting ON u

Postby paid_influencer » February 9th, 2022, 10:57 pm

nah, I just saying this generation and the next living in hellworld. Having to bear the cost of NIB payments for the last generation who had the money and the capacity to save more in their time, well that is just the cherry on the poop pile.

retirement at 65 might as well not exist for vast swaths of the population in hellworld

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Re: NIB Deficiting ON u

Postby hover11 » February 9th, 2022, 11:03 pm

paid_influencer wrote:nah, I just saying this generation and the next living in hellworld. Having to bear the cost of NIB payments for the last generation who had the money and the capacity to save more in their time, well that is just the cherry on the poop pile.

retirement at 65 might as well not exist for vast swaths of the population in hellworld
I could be wrong but isn't retirement in the states 67, how many ppl living to see that? Also remember we have an aging population, more retirees mean more money nib needs to find to add to it's recurring expenditure

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Re: NIB Deficiting ON u

Postby ProtonPowder » February 9th, 2022, 11:13 pm

paid_influencer wrote:nah, I just saying this generation and the next living in hellworld. Having to bear the cost of NIB payments for the last generation who had the money and the capacity to save more in their time, well that is just the cherry on the poop pile.

retirement at 65 might as well not exist for vast swaths of the population in hellworld

retirement is moreso a financial status than an age as time goes on

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Re: NIB Deficiting ON u

Postby Redman » February 10th, 2022, 7:29 am

People retiring later is a trend since the 90s
People living longer is a trend since forever.
Things costing more is a trend since forever.
Political patronage through nib 8s a trend since forever.

This situation has been on their books for more than a decade.

Steups

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Re: NIB Deficiting ON u

Postby pugboy » February 10th, 2022, 7:33 am

meanwhile your mp cabinet, judges have a 50k pension ensured

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Re: NIB Deficiting ON u

Postby hover11 » February 10th, 2022, 8:31 am

Redman wrote:People retiring later is a trend since the 90s
People living longer is a trend since forever.
Things costing more is a trend since forever.
Political patronage through nib 8s a trend since forever.

This situation has been on their books for more than a decade.

Steups
Agreed it have ppl collecting their pension and going back to work so I guess they don't need to "retire". When they do that they not really contributing, the employer pays something next to nothing under something called the Z CLASS

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Re: NIB Deficiting ON u

Postby infinite_RPM » February 10th, 2022, 9:10 am

How will this move affect persons in the private sector, who are approaching 60?

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Re: NIB Deficiting ON u

Postby hover11 » February 10th, 2022, 9:14 am

infinite_RPM wrote:How will this move affect persons in the private sector, who are approaching 60?
Well just to be clear retirement age in NIB definition is really 65, however, due to public servants and others like the private sector they accommodate applications from age 60. There has to be shift , make It 61 or 62 then work it's way fully to 65.

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Re: NIB Deficiting ON u

Postby pugboy » February 10th, 2022, 9:20 am

salt
unless you and or employer have a separate pension plan eg from an insurance company

this warning yet again should be a msg to all to take their own investment measures to secure their finances
because them govt ppl have their pension ensured

infinite_RPM wrote:How will this move affect persons in the private sector, who are approaching 60?

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Re: NIB Deficiting ON u

Postby Bad Dog » February 10th, 2022, 10:55 am

Hover11 please check your PM, thanks.

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Re: NIB Deficiting ON u

Postby zoom rader » February 10th, 2022, 11:11 am

hover11 wrote:
paid_influencer wrote:nah, I just saying this generation and the next living in hellworld. Having to bear the cost of NIB payments for the last generation who had the money and the capacity to save more in their time, well that is just the cherry on the poop pile.

retirement at 65 might as well not exist for vast swaths of the population in hellworld
I could be wrong but isn't retirement in the states 67, how many ppl living to see that? Also remember we have an aging population, more retirees mean more money nib needs to find to add to it's recurring expenditure
The level of service u get in US & UK is far greater than dis 5hithole.

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Re: NIB Deficiting ON u

Postby 88sins » February 10th, 2022, 9:47 pm

We have
An aging population, that living longer, high unemployment rates for the last few years, illegal immigrants who don't pay contributions flooding in job market, ever rising cost of living, and rounds of retrenchment of thousands of people. This was bound to happen eventually.

Welcome to the NIS pension system, our legal ponzi scheme.

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Re: NIB Deficiting ON u

Postby Gladiator » February 10th, 2022, 10:48 pm

....the PNM siphon out all of the money from NIB and into the NIF bonds to do what exactly who knows?...pay million dollar rents??? Now NIB broke.... do the balisier dance right foot/Left foot PNM

https://www.guardian.co.tt/news/nib-def ... 645c304948

Concerns and questions are being raised about the National Insurance Board’s (NIB) billion-dollar investment in the National Investment Fund (NIF).

The main concern seems to stem from the NIB’s admission during a Joint Select Committee (JSC) hearing last year that the NIB fund could go bankrupt in 12 years if significant changes are not implemented.

Despite that dim outlook, the NIB was able to invest $1 billion dollars in the NIF, becoming the single largest investor in the fund.

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Re: NIB Deficiting ON u

Postby zoom rader » February 10th, 2022, 11:17 pm

Gladiator wrote:....the PNM siphon out all of the money from NIB and into the NIF bonds to do what exactly who knows?...pay million dollar rents??? Now NIB broke.... do the balisier dance right foot/Left foot PNM

https://www.guardian.co.tt/news/nib-def ... 645c304948

Concerns and questions are being raised about the National Insurance Board’s (NIB) billion-dollar investment in the National Investment Fund (NIF).

The main concern seems to stem from the NIB’s admission during a Joint Select Committee (JSC) hearing last year that the NIB fund could go bankrupt in 12 years if significant changes are not implemented.

Despite that dim outlook, the NIB was able to invest $1 billion dollars in the NIF, becoming the single largest investor in the fund.
1% took the money

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Re: NIB Deficiting ON u

Postby hover11 » February 11th, 2022, 2:03 am

88sins wrote:We have
An aging population, that living longer, high unemployment rates for the last few years, illegal immigrants who don't pay contributions flooding in job market, ever rising cost of living, and rounds of retrenchment of thousands of people. This was bound to happen eventually.

Welcome to the NIS pension system, our legal ponzi scheme.
Well said, when politicians on both sides were jumping up every election time. Vote for me I will increase your NIS pension, ppl wasn't thinking where that increase was actually coming from. Well now we facing the consequences of such.

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Re: NIB Deficiting ON u

Postby pugboy » February 11th, 2022, 5:19 am

they never think of consequences

when one raised the “old age” free social welfare pension to more than the nis contributed pension just showed the rank stupidity and lack of understanding or should i say deliberate irresponsibility by the so-called leaders

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Re: NIB Deficiting ON u

Postby Redman » February 11th, 2022, 6:59 am

It's a little more complicated than that.

These types of funds all over the world are having similar issues...or had similar issues.

We might be unique or uncommon in the amount of nothing being done.


The nature of the fund, requires a high degree of liquidity, cash equivalents and various fixed income instruments.However since the WTC the US Fed Reserve has kept interest rates low.

Low rates means a large part of the portfolio isn't generating any income, and forces the fund manager to go into more risky investments to hunt for yield.
Low rates also change equity valuation models, and given the stock mkts a different personality.

NIB I believe is also.limited in their ability to invest internationally, and this is a very big fish in a small pond.

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Re: NIB Deficiting ON u

Postby hover11 » February 11th, 2022, 7:31 am

Redman wrote:It's a little more complicated than that.

These types of funds all over the world are having similar issues...or had similar issues.

We might be unique or uncommon in the amount of nothing being done.


The nature of the fund, requires a high degree of liquidity, cash equivalents and various fixed income instruments.However since the WTC the US Fed Reserve has kept interest rates low.

Low rates means a large part of the portfolio isn't generating any income, and forces the fund manager to go into more risky investments to hunt for yield.
Low rates also change equity valuation models, and given the stock mkts a different personality.

NIB I believe is also.limited in their ability to invest internationally, and this is a very big fish in a small pond.
Redman,

You are correct there is a limit of 20 percent of investment can be done internationally while 80 percent must be done locally, however, understand something the actuaries we have warned us. We call them mad ppl in their room just playing with numbers whole day, they warned us that if this continues from 2015 , they saw the trend that was occurring, no one took heed. Imagine paying a group of ppl to help make decisions for the benefit and sustainability of the fund and then ignoring them completely. As they say politics come into the play no government wants to be the bad one to make the unpopular decisions but politics isn't about being liked it's about getting the job done and at any cost.

The actuaries proposed

Increase contribution income percentage by 13.2 percent in 2016 and every year thereafter increase by 1.2 percent. That was not done. They simply kicked the can down the road hoping for something to magically spark life back into the economy .

They recommended cut some benefits because some of them we can clearly do without. Our main priority is paying pensions but from the looks of it I question if we are no better than social welfare or infact turned to being a welfare state on the whole.

They recommended to raise that retirement age as to limit the number of pensioners being added to the system thus giving more young persons time to come on the system and help maintain it. It is frightening to say the least that you may be paying for a retiree to get his pension every month but no one is paying for you to get yours when you should reach the age.

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Re: NIB Deficiting ON u

Postby 88sins » February 11th, 2022, 11:48 am

hover11 wrote:
Redman wrote:It's a little more complicated than that.

These types of funds all over the world are having similar issues...or had similar issues.

We might be unique or uncommon in the amount of nothing being done.


The nature of the fund, requires a high degree of liquidity, cash equivalents and various fixed income instruments.However since the WTC the US Fed Reserve has kept interest rates low.

Low rates means a large part of the portfolio isn't generating any income, and forces the fund manager to go into more risky investments to hunt for yield.
Low rates also change equity valuation models, and given the stock mkts a different personality.

NIB I believe is also.limited in their ability to invest internationally, and this is a very big fish in a small pond.
Redman,

You are correct there is a limit of 20 percent of investment can be done internationally while 80 percent must be done locally, however, understand something the actuaries we have warned us. We call them mad ppl in their room just playing with numbers whole day, they warned us that if this continues from 2015 , they saw the trend that was occurring, no one took heed. Imagine paying a group of ppl to help make decisions for the benefit and sustainability of the fund and then ignoring them completely. As they say politics come into the play no government wants to be the bad one to make the unpopular decisions but politics isn't about being liked it's about getting the job done and at any cost.

The actuaries proposed

Increase contribution income percentage by 13.2 percent in 2016 and every year thereafter increase by 1.2 percent. That was not done. They simply kicked the can down the road hoping for something to magically spark life back into the economy .

They recommended cut some benefits because some of them we can clearly do without. Our main priority is paying pensions but from the looks of it I question if we are no better than social welfare or infact turned to being a welfare state on the whole.


They recommended to raise that retirement age as to limit the number of pensioners being added to the system thus giving more young persons time to come on the system and help maintain it. It is frightening to say the least that you may be paying for a retiree to get his pension every month but no one is paying for you to get yours when you should reach the age.


see that increasing pension age? the idea in part behind that is so hopefully less ppl reach the age to qualify (ie pay NIS yuh whole life & drop dead before you can get it & they keep yuh money) , & when yuh dead before you can start to collect, well those contributions you made remain in the pot.

allyuh feel that the NIB is a hustle/ponzi scheme in joke

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Re: NIB Deficiting ON u

Postby hover11 » February 11th, 2022, 11:58 am

88sins wrote:
hover11 wrote:
Redman wrote:It's a little more complicated than that.

These types of funds all over the world are having similar issues...or had similar issues.

We might be unique or uncommon in the amount of nothing being done.


The nature of the fund, requires a high degree of liquidity, cash equivalents and various fixed income instruments.However since the WTC the US Fed Reserve has kept interest rates low.

Low rates means a large part of the portfolio isn't generating any income, and forces the fund manager to go into more risky investments to hunt for yield.
Low rates also change equity valuation models, and given the stock mkts a different personality.

NIB I believe is also.limited in their ability to invest internationally, and this is a very big fish in a small pond.
Redman,

You are correct there is a limit of 20 percent of investment can be done internationally while 80 percent must be done locally, however, understand something the actuaries we have warned us. We call them mad ppl in their room just playing with numbers whole day, they warned us that if this continues from 2015 , they saw the trend that was occurring, no one took heed. Imagine paying a group of ppl to help make decisions for the benefit and sustainability of the fund and then ignoring them completely. As they say politics come into the play no government wants to be the bad one to make the unpopular decisions but politics isn't about being liked it's about getting the job done and at any cost.

The actuaries proposed

Increase contribution income percentage by 13.2 percent in 2016 and every year thereafter increase by 1.2 percent. That was not done. They simply kicked the can down the road hoping for something to magically spark life back into the economy .

They recommended cut some benefits because some of them we can clearly do without. Our main priority is paying pensions but from the looks of it I question if we are no better than social welfare or infact turned to being a welfare state on the whole.


They recommended to raise that retirement age as to limit the number of pensioners being added to the system thus giving more young persons time to come on the system and help maintain it. It is frightening to say the least that you may be paying for a retiree to get his pension every month but no one is paying for you to get yours when you should reach the age.


see that increasing pension age? the idea in part behind that is so hopefully less ppl reach the age to qualify (ie pay NIS yuh whole life & drop dead before you can get it & they keep yuh money) , & when yuh dead before you can start to collect, well those contributions you made remain in the pot.

allyuh feel that the NIB is a hustle/ponzi scheme in joke
Sins,

Question to you, how many ppl die before 60 and NEVER claimed in their lives? While a man could have 20 children only worked for one year of his life, when he dies suddenly, NIB has to pay each child a monthly figure of at least 600 dollars until the age of 19. Yeah it's a ponzi scheme but certain ppl working it.


Retirement Grant....we pay THREE times what you put into the system and even upon death your relatives can still claim a funeral grant. We just giving away money.

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Re: NIB Deficiting ON u

Postby The_Honourable » February 11th, 2022, 12:08 pm

So with the kicking the can down the road culture we have, NIB at some point will become insolvent and the government of the day will bail them out. A much higher contribution income percentage would be imposed and we will like it so.

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Re: NIB Deficiting ON u

Postby mero » February 11th, 2022, 12:24 pm

NIB also need to publish names of them nasty unscrupulous businesses who robbing the system and robbing their employees year after year

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Re: NIB Deficiting ON u

Postby hover11 » February 11th, 2022, 12:26 pm

mero wrote:NIB also need to publish names of them nasty unscrupulous businesses who robbing the system and robbing their employees year after year
Yea but then their "friends" in high places didn't like that so it was stopped. It is written in the act but they don't use that method anymore , business reputation would tank.

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Re: NIB Deficiting ON u

Postby hover11 » February 11th, 2022, 12:27 pm

The_Honourable wrote:So with the kicking the can down the road culture we have, NIB at some point will become insolvent and the government of the day will bail them out. A much higher contribution income percentage would be imposed and we will like it so.
You thought Clico was bad you ain see nothing yet and when it finally restructure, half them benefits will cut

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Re: NIB Deficiting ON u

Postby Redman » February 11th, 2022, 4:26 pm

The 8 the review recommended increasing contributions etc.
It was done in 2010.



https://nibtt.net/Actuarial_Review/8th_ ... eview.html


8th Actuarial Reviews
The present actuarial review covers the 5-year period up to 30 June 2010 and presents a projection of the financial situation of the National Insurance System for the next 50 years.

Experience of the NIS since the last actuarial review
Contribution income and benefit expenditures have closely matched projections over the period from 1 July 2005 to 30 June 2010. The TT$3.3 billion shortfall in accumulated assets at the end of the financial year 2009-2010 is essentially due to unfavourable deviations regarding investment returns.

With effect from January 2008, a new contribution rate schedule has been adopted and modifications have been introduced to different benefits. In February 2012, the minimum pension has been increased to TT$3,000. All these modifications are reflected in the present actuarial review.

During the period from 1 July 2005 to 30 June 2010, the cumulative inflation rate reached 52.3 percent. This must be considered for the adjustment of benefits in January 2013.

Demographic pressure
The total population of Trinidad and Tobago will increase from 1,317,714 in 2010 to 1,431,642 in 2036 and will then initiate a slow decrease to reach 1,341,694 in 2060. The number of persons at pensionable age (60 and over) will grow from 161,051 in 2010 to 412,423 in 2060, while the population aged 16 to 59 (the contributory base) will decrease by 18 per cent. The number of working-age persons for each person aged 60 and over will thus fall dramatically from 5.4 to 1.7 over the projection period.

NIS demographic and financial projections
The total number of pensioners is projected to increase significantly in the future, from 112,553 in 2009-10 to 321,953 in 2060, while at the same time the number of contributors will fluctuate around 500,000 for the next 25 years and then start to decline to 400,000 in 2059-60. The ratio of contributors to pensioners will thus decrease from 4.3 to 1.3 over the next 50 years.

Financial projections reveal that system’s expenditure will exceed contribution income from financial year 2012-13. Total assets of the NIS will however continue to increase until 2026-27. From 2027-28, assets will rapidly decrease and the NIS funds will be completely depleted in 2039-40 if nothing is modified in terms of contributions or benefits of the system. The pay-as-you-go (PAYG) cost rate is projected to increase from its current level of 9.1 percent in 2010-11 to 29.8 percent in 2059-60. The general average premium of the system (the constant contribution rate necessary to finance all NIS benefits over the next 50 years) is 17.6 percent. This may be compared to the present contribution rate of 11.4 percent.

The contribution rate should be increased from 2013 at least to face the PAYG cost of the system over the period 2013-2017.

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Re: NIB Deficiting ON u

Postby K74T » February 11th, 2022, 5:43 pm

Douen doh stick

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