The Religion Discussion

[megadoc1]

^ exactly how would we have prevented that Australia earthquake?
Or Hurricane Katrina or the Haiti Earthquake or the Indian Ocean tsunami?

well we are called to be like Jesus and he promised that whoever believes in Him, the things He did we can do also and even greater things because he was going back to heaven
and Jesus did rebuked the weather when he walked the earth
so I suggest we go about doing it the same way he did

[Duane 3NE 2NR]

^ so why then, if this is what you believe, don't you and your group prevent these natural disasters from taking place?

If you have similar power to Jesus and can cast out curses and demons you can prevent these earthquakes and floods and hurricanes too?

[megadoc1]

^ so why then, if this is what you believe, don't you and your group prevent these natural disasters from taking place? maybe we do but how would
you know ? thats a tough one

If you have similar power to Jesus and can cast out curses and demons you can prevent these earthquakes and floods and hurricanes too? we don't have similar power to Jesus, he is the power, we just have the authority to command in His name

[megadoc1]

You have to understand megadoc... and forgive him. His "religion" was acquired while he was undergoing some serious stress, and this has made him a rabid convert... and on top of that, the puddle he chose to dive into to cool his heathen ardour was that of a fundamentalist Christian variety - and that thrives on rabid converts, stressing a quasi-spirituality, especially at the expense of knowledge/learning.
So you are dealing with an ignorant fanatic, whose lack of knowledge about the very religion he claims adherence to makes discussion difficult - he doesn't understand what you say due to the latter, and he isn't interested in what you say due to the former.
At least he recognizes the presence of the mountain we all have to climb... his only failings are that he often thinks he has reached the summit, and that he thinks his path is the only way up.
If you have not had much dealings with this ilk of "Christian", then I would suggest reading a former (now locked) thread started by Rjaggs, "Did Jesus rise from the dead?" It makes most amusing reading, as well as showing the true creature that megadoc really is...
.

on this note d spike I will take the opportunity to apologize for my behavior towards you
I am very very sorry for my actions and the total lack of respect I showed you back then, it was unfortunate and no human being should be on the receiving end of such from a christian, I want you to know that even though I may not agree with you, I have learnt alot from you and have grown to have a lot of respect for you, you sir are truly a Gem.
however because of my silly actions, I think I might have caused you to conclude things about me that are not really accurate, especially in what is quoted above,
it is regrettable and I think it is unfair to you to be holding such a view now
because it won't be true and you would be holding a position that is in error
you don't deserve that and I take full responsibility for it
again I am very sorry
oh and I have a confession to make I am a Jesus freak

[sMASH]

^ exactly how would we have prevented that Australia earthquake?
Or Hurricane Katrina or the Haiti Earthquake or the Indian Ocean tsunami?

fleck de hurricane, poison, snake bite; i want to see a come back from a decapitation
whey illuminatti, call him if allyuh goin an attempt this, he would like to see it.

[voice=southernbiblethumper] nooo, we are not supposed to tempt the powers of gaaaaad. he is maghty and lord of all things.[/end]

[sMASH]

^ so why then, if this is what you believe, don't you and your group prevent these natural disasters from taking place? maybe we do but how would
you know ? thats a tough one

If you have similar power to Jesus and can cast out curses and demons you can prevent these earthquakes and floods and hurricanes too? we don't have similar power to Jesus, he is the power, we just have the authority to command in His name

so would that same power be available if u asked god directly with out invoking jesus' name?

[Duane 3NE 2NR]

^ so why then, if this is what you believe, don't you and your group prevent these natural disasters from taking place?

maybe we do but how would you know ? thats a tough one

if you do then why do these terrible natural disasters happen anyway?

there is no need to be cryptic - a straightforward, clear answer is all that is needed

[Chimera]

yuh know if a earthquake hit Trinidad and ONLY champion dynamics building/church get flattened/destroyed and half the followers dead , megadoc1 guh come and say "that was Gods plan, we didn't want that building anymore and those followers were not loyal"

[megadoc1]

^ so why then, if this is what you believe, don't you and your group prevent these natural disasters from taking place?

maybe we do but how would you know ? thats a tough one

if you do then why do these terrible natural disasters happen anyway?
Duane all my life in this country I have no experience of terrible natural disasters
these things are territorial, I don't think that I am capable of explain this to you
though

there is no need to be cryptic - a straightforward, clear answer is all that is needed

[megadoc1]

yuh know if a earthquake hit Trinidad and ONLY champion dynamics building/church get flattened/destroyed and half the followers dead , megadoc1 guh come and say "that was Gods plan, we didn't want that building anymore and those followers were not loyal"

lol..... its actually God's plan to destroy that building right now and put up a new structure its in the works
but by the mean time register here for any fear you want God to remove in your life
http://www.trinituner.com/v3/forums/viewtopic.php?p=5136502#p5136502

[megadoc1]

^ so why then, if this is what you believe, don't you and your group prevent these natural disasters from taking place? maybe we do but how would
you know ? thats a tough one

If you have similar power to Jesus and can cast out curses and demons you can prevent these earthquakes and floods and hurricanes too? we don't have similar power to Jesus, he is the power, we just have the authority to command in His name

so would that same power be available if u asked god directly with out invoking jesus' name?

its the same person but that's the name given in which we exercise our authority
we don't need to go through this again if you don't get it .... cool?

[brainchild]

What, milk and honey? Please... You have any idea what a diet of milk and honey will do to the other end of you? (If this were true, then hell would definitely be the sewers of heaven...)
All scripture MUST be read in the context of the time and culture in which it was written. I stated this before and a fundamentalist here took umbrage. Paradise is always described as being bounteous in whatever was rare (and thus desired greatly).
Please remember, that no one has been there and returned with eye-witness accounts...

True but there are those that would argue that we don't have to worry about bowel movements in heaven, lol.

We were put here as a people, to achieve something as a people. (One reason why suicide is wrong.) Life is beautiful, but too short for an individual to achieve God's plan (if there is one) on his own. This is what i'm getting at..what if a big part of that plan is to move away from following scripture so dogmatically and take the knowledge acquired from them and put a realistic plan in action? We each go through life, meeting far too many individuals, to interact fully with each... far too many problems and ills exist for any one of us to deal with - alone. We can run to a "God" for solace, but in every example of this, we are told that the answer lies within us as a people. We are "Christ" to each other - or whatever you want to call it.Once again...it is up to us to create heaven on earth

We are called as a people to achieve something wonderful, over time (hence the reason for procreation) and this is what was meant for us.
The world isn't going to end in a fit of God's anger and frustration with our inability to do what's right (that would mean the Devil won and God failed, wouldn't it?) but when we succeed in doing our part in the Great Scheme of things/"God's plan".

We were brought into being - whether created in an instant, or brought into creation over a period of time (evolved?), is neither here nor there - as a race that propagates itself, and hands down knowledge across generations. This has to be for a reason. We are meant to achieve something... something good and wonderful... so wonderful, that its achievement will be known to all when it comes about, everyone will be aware of it and its meaning... and the role the Creator played in all time. This is the plan. Its achievement will be the glory of our race, and to the greater glory of him who made us, and gave us the gifts to achieve. (Unfortunately, many people see the end of our time here as cataclysmic - thanks to the apocalyptic idiom used by the Jews - and a sort of 'victory dance' for "us" to do over the defeated "them".)

We are on the same page...i have always spoken of interpretation of the scriptures (not so much here though)and the way i see it might have been the original blueprint for building paradise but we took it all in the wrong context. Instead of learning from the documented mistakes of the past and see that we have all the material to create the utopia our fore-forefathers dreamed of we are repeating them in an almost irreparable way.

As for the blind followers i spoke of, maybe i'm too optimistic i believe that ignorant and docile individuals are products of their environment, therefore through altering the environment(for the better) we can breed more self aware individuals.

[Duane 3NE 2NR]

^ so why then, if this is what you believe, don't you and your group prevent these natural disasters from taking place?

maybe we do but how would you know ? thats a tough one

if you do then why do these terrible natural disasters happen anyway?
Duane all my life in this country I have no experience of terrible natural disasters
these things are territorial, I don't think that I am capable of explain this to you
though

there is no need to be cryptic - a straightforward, clear answer is all that is needed

territorial? So you are saying that nothing has happened in Trinidad because your Christian group has been protecting this country?
So then Australia have no real Christians?

If you are incapable of explaining it here, can you get someone who can?

[brainchild]

Population control people...it's part of nature...from hurricanes, floods, volcanic eruptions, droughts...all natural disasters. Animals (whether in the bush, sea, mountains) experience it, trees and plants get their share....so who are we to be immune?

Loss of life is always sad and i hope we never get our turn (as pointless as such a hope is) but dats jus the way it is! We can't control these things and the day we start controlling them we'll see the population get out of control very quickly( it already is getting there at a slower pace).

[Duane 3NE 2NR]

^ who is controlling the population? is it a conscious decision on where to control and by how much?

disease, genetic deficiency etc perhaps are ways of nature controlling itself by way of survival of the fittest, but if you say an earthquake in a populated city is population control then who made the conscious decision to control THAT specific population in that area?

[brainchild]

^ who is controlling the population? is it a conscious decision on where to control and by how much?

disease, genetic deficiency etc perhaps are ways of nature controlling itself by way of survival of the fittest, but if you say an earthquake in a populated city is population control then who made the conscious decision to control THAT specific population in that area?

It's not specific...nature is random, but regardless of where these random events take place someting gets killed. As far as we know the extinction of dinosaurs wasn't planned but they were affected by watever random event that took place.

And no one may be controlling it but they did let it happen because i'm sure they knew the city was on a fault line but those in charge decided to wait it out and hope rather than relocate an entire city. We experience the same with floods..these fools redirect a river and build a community on the spot then throw blame all over when they get flood out.

[Duane 3NE 2NR]

^ not random but rather natural selection

but how does an earthquake in a city full of people be classified as natural selection?

[sMASH]

it can be seen as a random act, but given that logic, u can call murder population control as well.
it has the same effect as a population control measure, but it is not a population control measure.
and i did not know new zealand was overpopulated, if it had happened in sao paulo, or calcutta u might have gotten away.

mega, if allyuh goin an attempt a come back after a decapitation, i dere, and i feel natti would like to come to.

and i dont understand because it does not make sense. the only time i only could conduct business with a rep or a son of the man, is because the real man too busy, unavailable or dont want to do business and tryin to dock.

[brainchild]

it can be seen as a random act, but given that logic, u can call murder population control murder isn't natural as well.
it has the same effect as a population control measure, but it is not a population control measure.
and i did not know new zealand was overpopulated, RANDOM...it doesn't check for population size before striking and i was refferring to the world population...not everywhere gets hit the same time, even if a asteroid were to hit one side of the planet the ppl on the other side wouldn't be directly affected. if it had happened in sao paulo, or calcutta u might have gotten away.

mega, if allyuh goin an attempt a come back after a decapitation, i dere, and i feel natti would like to come to.

and i dont understand because it does not make sense. the only time i only could conduct business with a rep or a son of the man, is because the real man too busy, unavailable or dont want to do business and tryin to dock.

[d spike]

You have to understand megadoc... and forgive him. His "religion" was acquired while he was undergoing some serious stress, and this has made him a rabid convert... and on top of that, the puddle he chose to dive into to cool his heathen ardour was that of a fundamentalist Christian variety - and that thrives on rabid converts, stressing a quasi-spirituality, especially at the expense of knowledge/learning.
So you are dealing with an ignorant fanatic, whose lack of knowledge about the very religion he claims adherence to makes discussion difficult - he doesn't understand what you say due to the latter, and he isn't interested in what you say due to the former.
At least he recognizes the presence of the mountain we all have to climb... his only failings are that he often thinks he has reached the summit, and that he thinks his path is the only way up.
If you have not had much dealings with this ilk of "Christian", then I would suggest reading a former (now locked) thread started by Rjaggs, "Did Jesus rise from the dead?" It makes most amusing reading, as well as showing the true creature that megadoc really is...
.

on this note d spike I will take the opportunity to apologize for my behavior towards you
I am very very sorry for my actions and the total lack of respect I showed you back then, it was unfortunate and no human being should be on the receiving end of such

What? Is the world ending?

I want you to know that even though I may not agree with you, I have learnt alot from you and have grown to have a lot of respect for you, you sir are truly a Gem.

Wha'z da' one?

Nah... ah needs tuh sit dong an' take ah breath...

however because of my silly actions, I think I might have caused you to conclude things about me that are not really accurate, especially in what is quoted above,
it is regrettable and I think it is unfair to you to be holding such a view now
because it won't be true and you would be holding a position that is in error

Nice spin.
Horsefeathers. Your "actions" only caused me to conclude that you were rude and evasive when faced with an opposition that you could not cope with.
Your statements were clearly and undeniably symptomatic of a school of thought (that doesn't require much thought, nor schooling for that matter) which I have described above and before.
Let me put it this way: Where am I in error in the statement that you quoted above? Or anywhere else in this thread? Or in any other?

you don't deserve that and I take full responsibility for it
again I am very sorry

oh and I have a confession to make I am a Jesus freak

"Freak" I can agree with.
(So tell me... how do you "un-rebuke" someone? If I had died between then and now, would I have been half-rebuked?)

Straighten up and fly right, kid.
We all have to share this little ball of mud and spit, so learn to find the things that you have in common with others, and stress those things.
I am not going to quibble with a Muslim whether Mohammad was a prophet or not - the fact that many of that gentleman's recorded words mirror what I believe is of far more importance... arguing whether Jesus was just a well-spoken, deep-thinking lad, or the son of God is a waste of breath here. This is a public forum where diverse folks meet... why stress our differences in a condescending or argumentative manner?

[d spike]

^ so why then, if this is what you believe, don't you and your group prevent these natural disasters from taking place?

maybe we do but how would you know ? thats a tough one

if you do then why do these terrible natural disasters happen anyway?
Duane all my life in this country I have no experience of terrible natural disasters
these things are territorial, I don't think that I am capable of explain this to you
though

there is no need to be cryptic - a straightforward, clear answer is all that is needed

Wait a minute...
So all those earthquakes, volcanoes, hurricanes, tsunami, famines and wars that we never had, were all averted by the prayers of your lil' gang? Wow...
Tell me... so what about those other countries that still suffer from these problems? Your lot doesn't pray for them, huh? Sounds rather selfish, don't you think? So God answers selfish or self-centred prayers?

Get real. Some naturally occurring stuff is just that - they occur naturally. We aren't here to beg the Big Man to save us from the hiccups in His Creation... we are here to rise above them. We are not measured by how long we spend pleading avoidance... but by how we lift each other up afterwards.

[mitsuboi]

A holy person once explained it to me like this....God is like this greatest energy...he send minute "sparks" of this energy in d form of deities...all religions have it ...the Hindus have Lord Shiva, Lord Hanuman etc....Muslims have their Prophets...Christians have their Saints...

These Deities com in a form everyone should be comfortable with....in India dey com as Indian...China as Bhudda...white ppl as Jesus Christ....an all the other tribes of d continents...be it Caribs, Arawaks, African, an whole list of others....dey all worship a God in their image....think abt it like dis.....say u r an indian an u see a chinese, a white man, an a indian comin to preach to u...who would u follow ???

[Duane 3NE 2NR]

A holy person once explained it to me like this....God is like this greatest energy...he send minute "sparks" of this energy in d form of deities...all religions have it ...the Hindus have Lord Shiva, Lord Hanuman etc....Muslims have their Prophets...Christians have their Saints...

These Deities com in a form everyone should be comfortable with....in India dey com as Indian...China as Bhudda...white ppl as Jesus Christ....an all the other tribes of d continents...be it Caribs, Arawaks, African, an whole list of others....dey all worship a God in their image....think abt it like dis.....say u r an indian an u see a chinese, a white man, an a indian comin to preach to u...who would u follow ???

I'd choose the person who was making the most sense

on another note Jesus wasnt white / caucasian

[brainchild]

A holy person once explained it to me like this....God is like this greatest energy...he send minute "sparks" of this energy in d form of deities...all religions have it ...the Hindus have Lord Shiva, Lord Hanuman etc....Muslims have their Prophets...Christians have their Saints...

These Deities com in a form everyone should be comfortable with....in India dey com as Indian...China as Bhudda...white ppl as Jesus Christ....an all the other tribes of d continents...be it Caribs, Arawaks, African, an whole list of others....dey all worship a God in their image....think abt it like dis.....say u r an indian an u see a chinese, a white man, an a indian comin to preach to u...who would u follow ???

Mitsu... ...really?? and u believed that one!
First of all the deities from india have many different colors and no set race, Jesus wasn't white...don't be fooled by the pics...Amerindians worship nature spirits which had no form and African deities have several forms for different tribes. Oh and all Christians saints were just ppl who did good deeds to put it simply and were honoured as saints after their death.

I'm not trying to insult you but u really should do a lil reading, just so that u don't repeat that to ur kids.

[mitsuboi]

I was just quoting....an d person who I heard it from follows both Hinduism an Christianity ...but it does make sense ....first of all u all or no one can prove what was Jesus Christ race (its all speculation)....secondly Hindu deities r portrayed as indian dispite their color....an thirdly if saints r jus ppl as u say...y r there prays devoted to them....som say if u recite the pray to St.Jude anything u ask for will be granted...there r also other prays to other saints to recite to help certain aspects of ur life..

In my 27 yrs (yes I'm that old)I've experienced a healthy religious background from all different sources (I'm a practising Hindu who went church for a couple yrs well an also heard a lot from Muslim broddas ....so I don't base my assumptions from hear say but mostly on my experiences

[brainchild]

I was just quoting....an d person who I heard it from follows both Hinduism an Christianity ...but it does make sense ....first of all u all or no one can prove what was Jesus Christ race (its all speculation)....secondly Hindu deities r portrayed as indian dispite their color....an thirdly if saints r jus ppl as u say...y r there prays devoted to them....som say if u recite the pray to St.Jude anything u ask for will be granted...there r also other prays to other saints to recite to help certain aspects of ur life..

In my 27 yrs (yes I'm that old)I've experienced a healthy religious background from all different sources (I'm a practising Hindu who went church for a couple yrs well an also heard a lot from Muslim broddas ....so I don't base my assumptions from hear say but mostly on my experiences

Wow...ok, try this one on. Look at the region Christ was from...how many white guys in that area? Christ was middle eastern.Even using ur own logic he would have to be of same race as d ppl he was leading to get them to follow him. What i said about the saints you can look up on wikipedia or something urself...the prayers were also written to honour them, alot like Muhammad who was a man who became a prophet and is now honured through prayer.
Indian deities are dressed in traditional indian garb and accessories but they have no one race unless it have some blue/animal hybrid indians somewhere in Calcutta that i'm yet to see.

Most Gods/deities what have you came about being worship through the power they displayed. Believe it or not race wasn't much of a factor back in the day, look at the Egyptians their gods also had animal heads, their rulers were black way back in the day but those in the later dynasties were bi-racial after being dominated by Rome.

Feel free to look up everything i've said.

[mitsuboi]

U r saying d same ting I say....I nvr said what race Christ was an yes he woulda been d same race as d ppl were....an abt d part bout deities being human ...yes I agree...Lord Krishna an Lord Rama both walked the earth as humans

[sMASH]

white people make a white jesus, and when black man get rights, they make a black one... every body doin wat deh want, when deh want

what we hold as fact is that he was a man, and some people worship him.

mitsuboys quote is interesting, if u take it as a scientifically measured fact then it would be wrong according to most theologies, but if u take it as an imaginative artistic description, it makes sense.

as i have said before, islam teaches that messengers were sent to many different peoples at different times. the core message was the same, but the finer details differed. after purposes of the finer details have accomplished what they were meant to, the protection over them was removed and the men in charge at that time had opportunity to modify them as they pleased.
the modification is how we have so many different types of religions, but why so many have similar core concepts. even in polytheistic religions, they say that they all emanate or are incarnations of one supreme. in islam there are the different qualities or names of god, and if u imagine that people personified the qualities or the names then u have a corruption resulting in polytheism.


i am not sayin it is right, i just see a way where it can come about, and can relate somewhat to it.

and brain, stop criticizing the people ting. dat is what they believe, and until u can prove that saint michael did not have a piece of god's spirit then stfu (lolz) take it as a nice tale, but dont knock them.

and then we have, 'from god we come, and to god is our eventual return'
and where god breathed into adam some of his life,,, *dont remember the specifics of the bible there.*

[Chimera]

I for sure wasn't trusting a indian God, he wudda make me donate all my money to a cruise to heaven.

[sMASH]

lolz,,, cuffie/chankarsing oops i forgot the cough.