the right to bear arms

[Rooki3]

give everybody the right to bear arms & some of them self wud rob.

this is tricky

[j.o.e]

Domestic murders/violence will sky rocket too I suspect... u know how much of allyuh woulda already kill wife/gf if yall had a gun. Rum+horn+gun=

And in trinidad we love our rum and we love to horn.

[rocknrolla]

listen.. there is gun control in many countries of the world right now. but guess what.. guns are readily available to anyone who wants one. it is not at all a hard thing to get. just lean out ur window and shout out u want an illegal gun and u can get one by the next few hrs. yes it is that bad the illegal gun trade. no law is able to stop or track criminals use of guns to completely eliminating their sources. trillions have been spent on that over the decades and the result is still failure to 100% control access to guns.

the same laws would apply.. u can only use it in self defense etc or face murder charges etc. so go ahead and play stupid and go shoot somebody cuz he tell u 'ur mom is a whore' or some other insult. proper training will be necessary. just as the police are trained to be disciplined and responsible about securing and using their firearm.

in sweden, the entire population is trained to use arms and are allowed to carry arms up to fully automatic weapons.. guess how much gun homicides they have per year. the number is too low to print! there'd be exams and training courses that would give citizens who enroll comparable training to a police officer.

the statistics are really clear on this one. gun prohibition gives the criminals the advantage. gun legalization makes them think twice cuz they dont know if the man or the store they trying to rob have armed ppl in it.

ever notice how the story goes on news headlines?

unarmed business owner shot dead by bandits. bandits escape with $50000 worth of loot.

vs

business owner shoots bandits in attempted robbery at a store.

anyone observing those 2 scenarios can know which story theyd rather be. at least with a gun u have a chance. without one.. u at the bandits mercy of whether they feel to shoot u or not. u at the mercy of an ambulance reaching before u lose too much blood. and u at the mercy of ur stolen property ever being recovered if the police are unable to acquire enough leads to track it down.

and well yes. u cud look at it as the state has failed to protect those who died and were robbed and raped at the hands of armed criminals. but the state is also its ppl. so more armed ppl is a more secure state. the freedom of the population to protect themselves with at least small arms will in itself increase national security.

[speedmelter]

we are not ready for this. give the common everyday man the legal right to firearm possession and you would have men showing of their little guns all over. guntas would seek to rob men of their legal weapons and probably shoot them more frequently knowing that they are armed.

armed robberies and murders in the U.S.A i believe has very little to do with citizens being defensively armed. i think its more to do with the efficient justice system they have, large detailed penitentiary system and good policing authorities. in fact i think legal firearm possession among civilians there is more for recreational purposes and to give a psychological boost to their safety.

[rocknrolla]

Domestic murders/violence will sky rocket too I suspect... u know how much of allyuh woulda already kill wife/gf if yall had a gun. Rum+horn+gun=

And in trinidad we love our rum and we love to horn.

an expected arguement.. but when ppl really want to kill their spouse with a gun they can still get one relatively easily via illegal networks. 6 degrees of separation makes illegal guns accessible to anyone who wants one. and if is not gun, is poison, cutlass chop, knife stabbing, burn down house etc. so what should we do? make knives, cutlass, poison and fire illegal?

the argument is invalid. the future must include arming citizens. the police cannot protect everyone. and with the global economy in the shitter.. we have no idea how bad things can get in the future regarding manpower and law enforcement recources. this could take some load off the government in providing security that simply put.. cannot be covered from corner to corner and top to bottom with standard law enforcement resources. not enough vehicles, not enough man power, no guaruntee a patrol will be passing when u are in distress 3 am in the morning on ur way home from work or a party using public transport. u cud get rob right in city gate.

[Conrad]

Gun control can't work cuz we can't control the guns that already here.

Allow bonded trained citizens to own fire arms for home protection.

If yuh carry it outside yuh yard jail/ fine etc.

Once a couple of them get kill breaking in that will stop.

The violence that on the streets is drug fueled,related and caused.
Dat cyah done.
So allow the rest of us to protect our families when INVARIABLY it comes home.

it shouldnt be for home alone. concealed carry permits should also be issued to select citizens to be armed when going about their daily business. our streets will be safer with more responsible, armed and trained citizens. is a different ballgame when the criminals not sure how many of their potential victims have something to answer back with.

the arguments above about criminal takin the gun from u and escalating to rocket launchers etc is real nonsense. it is much harder to smuggle a rocket launcher into this country than small arms. but with a proper system to registering firearm owners it will be alot easier to figure out where the criminals getting guns from.

citizens can enroll in training programs that will teah0ch them about securing their weapon.

bandit does take gun from police and shoot them with it?

bandit getting rocket launchers to shoot police? no!.. so joke is joke but this is a topic of serious discussion. and i urge everyone to support the train of thought that allows arming of the population.

Full support of responsible citizens being armed but you surely just didnt compare a bandit taking a gun from an individual (or his home) to an armed police (or police station) which is by far more secured than the average person.

You're not aware of the instances where it criminals allegedly rent guns from officers. Of course some may be rumshop talk but the mere idea that it could be suggested should not make one naive especially considering that this is TRINIDAD AND TOBAGO we're talking about.

We're a loooong way from the average citizen having the right to bear arms and I'm glad as we're yet to show that our society is mature enough. Hell, some security officers have been known to brandish their arms when found in a dispute off-shift!

[rocknrolla]

we are not ready for this. give the common everyday man the legal right to firearm possession and you would have men showing of their little guns all over. guntas would seek to rob men of their legal weapons and probably shoot them more frequently knowing that they are armed.

armed robberies and murders in the U.S.A i believe has very little to do with citizens being defensively armed. i think its more to do with the efficient justice system they have, large detailed penitentiary system and good policing authorities. in fact i think legal firearm possession among civilians there is more for recreational purposes and to give a psychological boost to their safety.

so y u dont suggest that applicants have to pass a screening process and training program? why it is WE not ready for this? i dont know bout u.. but i am. and i aint plan on killin bandits either ill shoot to injure and train at the range to improve my aim for those targets. thats what its about. u wont give a drunk a gun permit. but if a person pass the screening process, evaluation and training to be of sound mind for carrying a weapon responsibly. y should it be denied?

i dont think it should. and ppl have a right to protect themselves. but they cant do that when criminals can control a situation from 5 feet or more away.

[j.o.e]

we get it OP..you want a gun. And granted with systems in place that might be a good idea. In a lawful society..but we are a lawless society. Let's find a system that works.
Licensing-nope
Judicial-nope
Education-nope
Public Trasnport-nope
Health Care-nope
Road maintenance-nope
Public Utilities-nope
do you get my point? why do you think we can do a good job at gun control? We are a lawless, indisciplined, corrupt society. We can't even give out school books without having hiccups.

[rocknrolla]

armed robberies and murders in the U.S.A i believe has very little to do with citizens being defensively armed. i think its more to do with the efficient justice system they have, large detailed penitentiary system and good policing authorities. in fact i think legal firearm possession among civilians there is more for recreational purposes and to give a psychological boost to their safety.

u need to take a look at state by state gun crime statistics vs states which have gun restrictions. as posted.. it is a unanimous statistic, that areas in the entire world that have gun restriction have higher gun homicide.. and the answer is simple..

criminals win when the playing field is sufficiently uneven and the citizens are at a disadvantage. because criminals will break the law to get an advantage.

[Rooki3]

before an individual is issued a firearm permit he/she should go thru extensive psychological monitoring & shud attend some 80+ hr class on anger nanagement or sumn

[rocknrolla]

u said gun control. but this is not gun control. it is more gun liberalization. gun control does not work. research the stats man.

and to be honest man. is not that i want a gun because i can get one legally and have never taken the opportunity which has been open to me for years. my faith is sufficiently strong that the Lord knows what's best for me and i can count on him to protect me. but that said, i think i may be considering getting armed. not just for myself, but to help protect others.

[GVTrini07]

Giving the Right to Bear Arms in Trinidad is like taking yuh dick out, putting it on the table and hitting it with a hammer.

Do you really want to do that???

[hustla_ambition101]

A man comparing Trinidad to Sweden, I lol'ed. TWO ENTIRELY DIFFERENT MENTALITIES. How much of you so called law abiding citizens drive within the speed limit, always wear your seat belts, never speak on cells while driving, never take a chance on the PBR, never take a chance along the shoulder, have proper lights, tyres etc on your vehicles, because all of these are laws and laws which are broken by the same people who chastise the bandits and murderers but guess what crime is crime.

[rocknrolla]

A man comparing Trinidad to Sweden, I lol'ed. TWO ENTIRELY DIFFERENT MENTALITIES. How much of you so called law abiding citizens drive within the speed limit, always wear your seat belts, never speak on cells while driving, never take a chance on the PBR, never take a chance along the shoulder, have proper lights, tyres etc on your vehicles, because all of these are laws and laws which are broken by the same people who chastise the bandits and murderers but guess what crime is crime.

i fall into all these categories. my police padnas commend me on how first thing i do is put on my seatbelt as i sit down. before i start the car. i rarely cross 80kmph because i not into speed and dont really trust cars. tho my screen name can be misleading. i just made this name to be trinituner car oriented. couldnt think of anything else at the time i wanted to sign up.
dont drive if i had even one beer and never have to date because i understand the effects of alcohol and not a chance taking kinda person.

i think u underestimating the amount of responsible law abiding citizens we have in this country. not everyone would seek gun ownership. not everyone is cut out for it. but there are those who could really be an asset if permitted, and we should definitely consider not denying them after a proper screening process.

[Chimera]

give everybody the right to bear arms & some of them self wud rob.

this is tricky

anyone who want to rob will rob

people don't use their legal firearms to do robberies.


legalize shot guns for everyone,no small arms

[hustla_ambition101]

A man comparing Trinidad to Sweden, I lol'ed. TWO ENTIRELY DIFFERENT MENTALITIES. How much of you so called law abiding citizens drive within the speed limit, always wear your seat belts, never speak on cells while driving, never take a chance on the PBR, never take a chance along the shoulder, have proper lights, tyres etc on your vehicles, because all of these are laws and laws which are broken by the same people who chastise the bandits and murderers but guess what crime is crime.

i fall into all these categories. my police padnas commend me on how first thing i do is put on my seatbelt as i sit down. before i start the car. i rarely cross 80kmph because i not into speed and dont really trust cars. tho my screen name can be misleading. i just made this name to be trinituner car oriented. couldnt think of anything else at the time i wanted to sign up.
dont drive if i had even one beer and never have to date because i understand the effects of alcohol and not a chance taking kinda person.

i think u underestimating the amount of responsible law abiding citizens we have in this country

Not at all, I traverse the CRH, PBR, UBH, and SMR 5 days for the week and is level lawlessness from the beatup b11 driver straight up to the range rover, benz, bmw etc driver. It is embedded in many a Trini to "take a chance" and do the wrong thing, the "have nots" believe they won't be caught and the "haves" can throw money around and not have to face consequences. Trinidad as a society has not matured to the level of the ordinary citizen carrying a firearm, people break out in fight for a simple touch on the shoulder or step on the foot.

[rocknrolla]

give everybody the right to bear arms & some of them self wud rob.

this is tricky

anyone who want to rob will rob

people don't use their legal firearms to do robberies.


legalize shot guns for everyone,no small arms

lol u want to turn the bandit and them into pulp now..lol

but ey they have no right runnin up in ppl house with arms anyhow. the soe stories i saw where they rape the ppl daughter and then bathe her off in the shower to wash away dna evidence was among the saddest. and is not once or twice it happen.

and i hear some ppl want to call for soe again.. madness.

[Rooki3]

give everybody the right to bear arms & some of them self wud rob.

this is tricky

anyone who want to rob will rob

people don't use their legal firearms to do robberies.


legalize shot guns for everyone,no small arms

good idea, wud wrk more for home use, ppl cant walk around with them, the guns should be brought to the police station to be inpsected tri-annually, anyobe who saws them off or tampers in anyway shud be charged & jailed

[rocknrolla]

A man comparing Trinidad to Sweden, I lol'ed. TWO ENTIRELY DIFFERENT MENTALITIES. How much of you so called law abiding citizens drive within the speed limit, always wear your seat belts, never speak on cells while driving, never take a chance on the PBR, never take a chance along the shoulder, have proper lights, tyres etc on your vehicles, because all of these are laws and laws which are broken by the same people who chastise the bandits and murderers but guess what crime is crime.

i fall into all these categories. my police padnas commend me on how first thing i do is put on my seatbelt as i sit down. before i start the car. i rarely cross 80kmph because i not into speed and dont really trust cars. tho my screen name can be misleading. i just made this name to be trinituner car oriented. couldnt think of anything else at the time i wanted to sign up.
dont drive if i had even one beer and never have to date because i understand the effects of alcohol and not a chance taking kinda person.

i think u underestimating the amount of responsible law abiding citizens we have in this country

Trinidad as a society has not matured to the level of the ordinary citizen carrying a firearm, people break out in fight for a simple touch on the shoulder or step on the foot.

u talkin about guntas and ghetto mentality. what about the rest of the ppl? u saying trinidad is only guntas and ghetto ppl living here and no responsible citizens mature enough to carry a small firearm with discipline?

if so there is a serious implication in that to say that it is from these same ppl the police and military choose their cadets. u saying all them is gunta with ghetto mentality who too irresponsible to carry a firearm?

[rocknrolla]

Gun control can't work cuz we can't control the guns that already here.

Allow bonded trained citizens to own fire arms for home protection.

If yuh carry it outside yuh yard jail/ fine etc.

Once a couple of them get kill breaking in that will stop.

The violence that on the streets is drug fueled,related and caused.
Dat cyah done.
So allow the rest of us to protect our families when INVARIABLY it comes home.

it shouldnt be for home alone. concealed carry permits should also be issued to select citizens to be armed when going about their daily business. our streets will be safer with more responsible, armed and trained citizens. is a different ballgame when the criminals not sure how many of their potential victims have something to answer back with.

the arguments above about criminal takin the gun from u and escalating to rocket launchers etc is real nonsense. it is much harder to smuggle a rocket launcher into this country than small arms. but with a proper system to registering firearm owners it will be alot easier to figure out where the criminals getting guns from.

citizens can enroll in training programs that will teah0ch them about securing their weapon.

bandit does take gun from police and shoot them with it?

bandit getting rocket launchers to shoot police? no!.. so joke is joke but this is a topic of serious discussion. and i urge everyone to support the train of thought that allows arming of the population.

Full support of responsible citizens being armed but you surely just didnt compare a bandit taking a gun from an individual (or his home) to an armed police (or police station) which is by far more secured than the average person.

You're not aware of the instances where it criminals allegedly rent guns from officers. Of course some may be rumshop talk but the mere idea that it could be suggested should not make one naive especially considering that this is TRINIDAD AND TOBAGO we're talking about.

We're a loooong way from the average citizen having the right to bear arms and I'm glad as we're yet to show that our society is mature enough. Hell, some security officers have been known to brandish their arms when found in a dispute off-shift!

and i think that this has everything to do with exposure.. or rather a lack of from an early age. if we train our citizens from young on how to handle various firearms and the responsibility that come with it can be etched into them at an early age.. this cud change alot of the immaturity factors ur citing.

how else trinis going to grow and evolve without exposure..

remember the overprotective parent? yeah his daughter still snuck out the window and got pregnant. the police cannot save everyone and they cannot be everywhere at the same time... that was the major point of the method of distributing soe zones. we dont have enough manpower to guard the whole country the way u all promise to.

well intentioned, but the maths is just not in ur favour.

[Rainman]

Own a registered firearm already, this does not affect me. Good day to you sirs

[rocknrolla]

Gun control can't work cuz we can't control the guns that already here.

Allow bonded trained citizens to own fire arms for home protection.

If yuh carry it outside yuh yard jail/ fine etc.

Once a couple of them get kill breaking in that will stop.

The violence that on the streets is drug fueled,related and caused.
Dat cyah done.
So allow the rest of us to protect our families when INVARIABLY it comes home.

nice idea, however, just playing devil's advocate here, but couldn't that just lead to an increase in crimes outside the home/ business place, heck it might even result in an upswing of kidnappings. Then there's the issue of older folk who may not be able to handle a shot gun even if they had one; the past few years or so, we've already seen several cases where the elderly are being targeted and victimized, this could increase as well

yes but the chances that someone nearby, a law abiding citizen and stranger cud be in a position to help at the scene of the crime to take down the criminals could be greatly increased. bandits wont know who have gun on them. so every robbery job would be a risky one. and we all know they fraid to dead. they cud kill and hurt ppl but when is their turn they does beg like lil woman.

i witness it with my own eyes a padna wrestle a gunman to the ground and the beyotch beg and beg and cry not to shoot when he get disarmed.

[tourniquet]

and to be honest man. is not that i want a gun because i can get one legally and have never taken the opportunity which has been open to me for years. my faith is sufficiently strong that the Lord knows what's best for me and i can count on him to protect me. but that said, i think i may be considering getting armed. not just for myself, but to help protect others.

not to go too off topic, but since you brought it up, is your faith waning, because it appears as though the underlined and bolded sections contradict themselves.
Anyway, on the topic of protecting ourselves, perhaps we should learn to creep before trying to run; how about we permit people to arm themselves with mace/ pepper spray, electroshock weapons, et al, before we start arming grandma with a shotgun

[Duane 3NE 2NR]

and to be honest man. is not that i want a gun because i can get one legally and have never taken the opportunity which has been open to me for years. my faith is sufficiently strong that the Lord knows what's best for me and i can count on him to protect me. but that said, i think i may be considering getting armed. not just for myself, but to help protect others.

not to go too off topic, but since you brought it up, is your faith waning, because it appears as though the underlined and bolded sections contradict themselves.
Anyway, on the topic of protecting ourselves, perhaps we should learn to creep before trying to run; how about we permit people to arm themselves with mace/ pepper spray, electroshock weapons, et al, before we start arming grandma with a shotgun

good point!

[rocknrolla]

and to be honest man. is not that i want a gun because i can get one legally and have never taken the opportunity which has been open to me for years. my faith is sufficiently strong that the Lord knows what's best for me and i can count on him to protect me. but that said, i think i may be considering getting armed. not just for myself, but to help protect others.

not to go too off topic, but since you brought it up, is your faith waning, because it appears as though the underlined and bolded sections contradict themselves.
Anyway, on the topic of protecting ourselves, perhaps we should learn to creep before trying to run; how about we permit people to arm themselves with mace/ pepper spray, electroshock weapons, et al, before we start arming grandma with a shotgun

i happen to know a wealthy businessman with a licensed firearm.. old and would miss me if he shot at me standing 5 feet in front of him. yet still he has a licensed firearm. they cud take it from him too, but that argument didnt stop him from getting one.

dont block giving power to the ppl to help defend themselves and thei community. community watch wouldnt have to shoot, but they cud subdue a gunman until police arrive. we need to start employing the resources of our citizens. evaluate them and assign them firearm permits based on the levels of their evaluation and training.

ppl being left to hang out to dry.

and to answer ur offtopic question.. no my faith is not waning. not in the least.

[Conrad]

and to be honest man. is not that i want a gun because i can get one legally and have never taken the opportunity which has been open to me for years. my faith is sufficiently strong that the Lord knows what's best for me and i can count on him to protect me. but that said, i think i may be considering getting armed. not just for myself, but to help protect others.

not to go too off topic, but since you brought it up, is your faith waning, because it appears as though the underlined and bolded sections contradict themselves.
Anyway, on the topic of protecting ourselves, perhaps we should learn to creep before trying to run; how about we permit people to arm themselves with mace/ pepper spray, electroshock weapons, et al, before we start arming grandma with a shotgun

THIS

[Rooki3]

agreed on starting with tazers

[rocknrolla]

armed robberies and murders in the U.S.A i believe has very little to do with citizens being defensively armed. i think its more to do with the efficient justice system they have, large detailed penitentiary system and good policing authorities. in fact i think legal firearm possession among civilians there is more for recreational purposes and to give a psychological boost to their safety.

u should do more research on the topic.

efficient justice system? look up the gun homicide count for chicago right now. and all of chicago has gun restriction. ppl just getting slaughtered.

and u really think a gunta will run at a man with a gun? u probably let their appearance get to u. they are for the most part yellow bellies who only look brave when they pointing the gun at u. but when the tables switch all that braveness does melt.

[Ted_v2]

guns dont kill people

people kill people

:ya:

[Conrad]

Texas is still experiencing break ins with their right to bear arms legislation intact. Hell a burglar got shot earlier this week hahahahaaaaa.

Tazers, pepper spray and other defensive weapons before guns not to forget more effective/consistent policing.