COVIDIOTS in Trinidad & Tobago

[BUG]

Then crashed down from December to March ... Tell me why did we have a reduction is cases during christmas into carnival and so on. The time of the year with loads of gatherings and case number went down.
Now yall saying Easter ... We all gonna die ...

It's amusing to see someone asking a question that has already been answered.

[BUG]

also welcome to the forum

Thanks! Long time lurker, first time poster yada yada yada

[sMASH]

Doesn't seem that bad.

We were in the same situation in Jan and back in Oct last year.

Those outbreaks were long before covid fatigue set in. It would be a mistake to try and compare last year's outbreak response to this year's.

We are within a perfect storm of: steadily increasing case numbers approaching a holiday period, a large amount of population movement, large amount of gatherings and fatigue related to measures used to control the spread of the virus.

It's a very worrying situation right now.

relax urself. let a two weeks pass before u could pronounce dat. this is on par with a lot of other things that we pay a lot less attention to. not meaning to say, to throw out all the precautions, but meaning that u have to accept a certain amount of spread must occur and wth that a certain amount of mortality.
what is the point of preserving the life of every body if nobody allowed to live?
the argument to that is, 'each life is important and u dont want any of ur people die from covid'
the counter to that is, life is about balancing risk with reward.

as the safety man by we said, if u want to be absolutely safe, u will stay home and never come out, but u will never acheive any thign that way, so u have to accept some risk and mitigate what u can.

[drchaos]

Then crashed down from December to March ... Tell me why did we have a reduction is cases during christmas into carnival and so on. The time of the year with loads of gatherings and case number went down.
Now yall saying Easter ... We all gonna die ...

It's amusing to see someone asking a question that has already been answered.

I think its more likely that people were not getting tested or poor test reporting.

If you are referring to a 3 month lead time to increase cases after lots of social events then, cases should increase for a few weeks then crash since Jan, Feb and March have not had many events and gatherings.

Death rate still continues to very low ... so relax, sit back and drink a beer bro.
There will be spikes and troughs, rinse and repeat until we get to a certain amount vaccinations then hopefully we can open the borders.
I itching to use meh tickets that got put on hold ... CAL, Virgin and Copa all refuse to refund meh money ... They just putting the tickets on hold.

[S_2NR]

Jeez yall real depressing ...

The chicken little syndrome is real in this place.

Everything is doom and gloom ... We all gonna die, Case numbers rising, everyone panic, worry yada yada yada.
Case numbers rose from Oct to Nov 2020 (which BTW was a bigger spike than you seeing now 120 per day vs 40)

Then crashed down from December to March ... Tell me why did we have a reduction is cases during christmas into carnival and so on. The time of the year with loads of gatherings and case number went down.
Now yall saying Easter ... We all gonna die ...

+1
Take necessary precautions, wear masks etc but people need to relax.
Covid isnt going away anytime soon.

[MaxPower]

Covid doesn't spread on the beach, it spreads in the cars and maxis on the way down.

And in the ferries and planes especially x2 accounting for return trips.

I wont say planes really as everyone basically has all protocols are usually followed and the environment is more controlled

If i can add the zesser parties with the wining and grining, the close face to face talking/spitting with loud music, the multiple hands grabbing ice and most importantly, the alcohol that gets the guard down.

[Dohplaydat]

Cases take time to build up, we have Pandemic fatigue and with the case numbers just a month ago being 0 on some days, everyone slacked off.

You shoulda see restaurants, bars etc last month, the change was palpable, we forgot Covid. But Covid didn't forget us.

Remember, Xmas everyone remembered the August/September spike so many were careful still

[BUG]

but people need to relax.

"Relaxing" is exactly the argument I've been making as to why we're barreling towards a crisis, so I fail to see how further relaxation is a good idea right now?

It's pretty simple, reduced (but not eliminated) cases is great but when it combines with covid fatigue you end up in this situation where risk averse people relax and risk tolerant people are tired of all the precautions we've been taking this last year so bars are pumping, all restaurants are serving alcohol, politicians are having unmasked arm wrestling parties, people packing onto ferries to holiday etc.

We had a good handle on it and should not have relaxed or become ambivalent when we had cases so low for about a month or so there. We're an island(s) nation, which is an enviable advantage for a country to have but we relaxed at the critical moment and now the moment is gone.

[sMASH]

so what to do, state of emergency?

[Dohplaydat]

so what to do, state of emergency?

Wear your mask bro

[drchaos]

but people need to relax.

"Relaxing" is exactly the argument I've been making as to why we're barreling towards a crisis, so I fail to see how further relaxation is a good idea right now?

It's pretty simple, reduced (but not eliminated) cases is great but when it combines with covid fatigue you end up in this situation where risk averse people relax and risk tolerant people are tired of all the precautions we've been taking this last year so bars are pumping, all restaurants are serving alcohol, politicians are having unmasked arm wrestling parties, people packing onto ferries to holiday etc.

We had a good handle on it and should not have relaxed or become ambivalent when we had cases so low for about a month or so there. We're an island(s) nation, which is an enviable advantage for a country to have but we relaxed at the critical moment and now the moment is gone.

I think its less that people have slacked off at a critical moment and more so that people need to get back to normal.
The population is more or less aware of the risks at this point in time and they have chosen to live their lives in a way that they deem fit. Social interaction is the bedrock of our human society and without it we fall apart.
There is a reason why solitary confinement is one of the worst and most damaging punishments we can enact on prisoners.
It drives you mad and don't think for a second that zoom and whatsapp makes up for this since most human interaction is not verbal and human touch and physical contact is absolutely necessary for the human experience.

[adnj]

so what to do, state of emergency?

The uptick started around mid-February. When the schools partially opened, you could see less social distancing and fewer masks being worn.

Easter is over, the damage is done. Vaccinations start Tuesday. Hope that more vaccine lands before the end of April.

Then wait 60 days for the cumulative deaths due to Covid-19 to double.

[drchaos]

so what to do, state of emergency?

The uptick started around mid-February. When the schools partially opened, you could see less social distancing and fewer masks being worn.

Easter is over, the damage is done. Vaccinations start Tuesday. Hope that more vaccine lands before the end of April.

Then wait 60 days for the cumulative deaths due to Covid-19 to double.

Ive been seeing fewer masking being worn since Nov, only a few months after the legislation was passed ... and the rural areas (even the crowded spaces) + Tobago have never really adopted the mask wearing protocols.

[redmanjp]

The problem is that it seems every man for himself, ppl think well I young I eh go end up dead or in hospital, and perhaps that's true (although a few young ppl have in fact ended up dead and more hospitalized), but they expose themselves and then would go an expose vulnerable ppl, strangers and even family members alike who end up paying the ultimate price. Because a lime is more important.

[sMASH]

and where are the concentrations of cases? caroni. but where did those cases get it from?
backroad and country side, people eh taking it on. and guess what, no cases from the places i saw that.

once a place is well ventilated, like outside, and people spaced out, the masks not doing any thing except cycling up ur respiratory material.

[drchaos]

The problem is that it seems every man for himself, ppl think well I young I eh go end up dead or in hospital, and perhaps that's true (although a few young ppl have in fact ended up dead and more hospitalized), but they expose themselves and then would go an expose vulnerable ppl, strangers and even family members alike who end up paying the ultimate price. Because a lime is more important.

If you are vulnerable then the burden to protect yourself is on you ... Not the people who are not vulnerable.

If 1% of people have a problem with driving/other drivers moving at 100Km on the highway. You get nervous and get panic attacks. Should we all reduce our speed to suit them or should we encourage they stay off the highway and seek mental health assistance to solve the problem.

[redmanjp]

But those same ppl who didn't give a damn would now complain when Govt who was warning everyone repeatedly to follow the protocols have no choice but to lockdown, with its consequent economic hardships.

[BUG]

If you are vulnerable then the burden to protect yourself is on you ... Not the people who are not vulnerable.

Restrictions are not about wrapping every individual person in cotton wool. Restrictions are to prevent a run on hospitals and emergency services so that the health system is not overwhelmed.

It doesnt take a genius to imagine what happens to the regular flow of services in units such as ICU's when all resources are being funneled to treat an flood of covid patients. If you only have a few covid cases coming in for treatment because everyone was disciplined and observed covid protocols, emergency services are freed up to help you when that panic attacked driver crashes into someone, if the hospital is full of covid patients, guess what, the car crash victim goes to the back of a very long line.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-latin-america-56424611

* Edited to remove the AMP link

[drchaos]

But those same ppl who didn't give a damn would now complain when Govt who was warning everyone repeatedly to follow the protocols have no choice but to lockdown, with its consequent economic hardships.

I think that's cause the vulnerable don't give a damn ... They have always expected society to protect them and to pick up the slack when they screw up.

I was not surprised to see how Trini's reacted when they shut down doubles and KFC.
Watch the other peoples carts in the grocery when you are checking out ... a sheit load of processed foods, foods high in sugar and Polyunsaturated fats.

People who actually take care of their healh, Eat well, Excercise, ensure they get adequate Vit D3 levels (Sunlight) we have to pay for the morons who want to "make themselves vulnerable" and then cry and complain when their health ends up in hot water?

Your risks of dyeing from respiratory infections goes up SIGNIFICANTLY with all chronic diseases, low blood vit D3 levels, mental health issues, lack of sleep and the list goes on and on.

[drchaos]

If you are vulnerable then the burden to protect yourself is on you ... Not the people who are not vulnerable.

Restrictions are not about wrapping every individual person in cotton wool. Restrictions are to prevent a run on hospitals and emergency services so that the health system is not overwhelmed.

It doesnt take a genius to imagine what happens to the regular flow of services in units such as ICU's when all resources are being funneled to treat an flood of covid patients. If you only have a few covid cases coming in for treatment because everyone was disciplined and observed covid protocols, emergency services are freed up to help you when that panic attacked driver crashes into someone, if the hospital is full of covid patients, guess what, the car crash victim goes to the back of a very long line.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co ... a-56424611

Who would be making runs on the health system the vulnerable or the non-vulnerable?
Lock down the vulnerable not the whole population.

[redmanjp]

You used traffic as an example. First of all there are protocols (traffic laws) to follow when driving, you can't do what u please because u endanger others. But unlike infectious diseases, if u cause an accident it isn't going to create a domino effect and exponentially increase the number of accidents that would happen- if it did then that would be justification to shutdown the roads.

With a virus which had both a higher mortality rate AND a high rate of spread it can quickly overwhelm hospitals with patients, increasing the mortality rate, and even affecting NON COVID patients. Thatis exactly what HAS happened in big rich countries such as US, UK and others who have better health care systems than us.

Yes it's true that ppl should take better care of their health but their health can't change overnight, also ppl get old, you certainly can't change that. Even some relative young ppl end up in hospital with this virus. Even ppl who never knew they had the virus because they had no symptoms are having lingering effects after, it isn't a normal virus.

[MarlonSam]

Lockdown 2 coming soon...

[Dohplaydat]

If you are vulnerable then the burden to protect yourself is on you ... Not the people who are not vulnerable.

Restrictions are not about wrapping every individual person in cotton wool. Restrictions are to prevent a run on hospitals and emergency services so that the health system is not overwhelmed.

It doesnt take a genius to imagine what happens to the regular flow of services in units such as ICU's when all resources are being funneled to treat an flood of covid patients. If you only have a few covid cases coming in for treatment because everyone was disciplined and observed covid protocols, emergency services are freed up to help you when that panic attacked driver crashes into someone, if the hospital is full of covid patients, guess what, the car crash victim goes to the back of a very long line.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc.co ... a-56424611

Who would be making runs on the health system the vulnerable or the non-vulnerable?
Lock down the vulnerable not the whole population.

I agree in theory but in reality, especially Trinidad, that can't work.

Lockdown 2 coming soon...

It might be inevitable, but we'll see.

[MaxPower]

Master Keith,

Lay the pipe.

Trinis asses are too happy.

A lockdown/roll back/SOE cannot change Trinis but it can certainly keep them away from protocol abiding citizens.

Lay the pipe.

[adnj]

But those same ppl who didn't give a damn would now complain when Govt who was warning everyone repeatedly to follow the protocols have no choice but to lockdown, with its consequent economic hardships.

About 1/4 of all the hospital beds in the country are expected to be occupied by a Covid-19 patient next month. That cost is unavoidable.

[Kenjo]

But those same ppl who didn't give a damn would now complain when Govt who was warning everyone repeatedly to follow the protocols have no choice but to lockdown, with its consequent economic hardships.

About 1/4 of all the hospital beds in the country are expected to be occupied by a Covid-19 patient next month. That cost is unavoidable.

Have any of these come true for Trinidad as yet or this is the first bad predictions we have had ?

[drchaos]

The end of days cult here has been projection mass deaths and total collapse of our health care system since this thing started last year.

By some miracle our lack of discipline, inability to follow rules, lack of mask wearing, social distancing and weddings/mass gatherings have continued to produce low covid numbers and deaths.

Then now they claim somehow that indiscipline during Easter will doom us all and take up 1/4 of hospital beds (omg 1 whole quarter?)

Kong vs Godzilla tonight!

[drchaos]

You used traffic as an example. First of all there are protocols (traffic laws) to follow when driving, you can't do what u please because u endanger others. But unlike infectious diseases, if u cause an accident it isn't going to create a domino effect and exponentially increase the number of accidents that would happen- if it did then that would be justification to shutdown the roads.

With a virus which had both a higher mortality rate AND a high rate of spread it can quickly overwhelm hospitals with patients, increasing the mortality rate, and even affecting NON COVID patients. Thatis exactly what HAS happened in big rich countries such as US, UK and others who have better health care systems than us.

Yes it's true that ppl should take better care of their health but their health can't change overnight, also ppl get old, you certainly can't change that. Even some relative young ppl end up in hospital with this virus. Even ppl who never knew they had the virus because they had no symptoms are having lingering effects after, it isn't a normal virus.

Wasn't using the traffic analogy to project impact on the health system it was a tool to show who we target and protect as a society.

We had a whole year for the authority to campaign better health, not over night.
Age is less of a factor vs overall health. Age tends to be correlated with poorer health but correlation is not causation.

Lay people/media/politicians (with their agendas) keep saying that this is not a normal virus but if you have no clue about respiratory viruses then making this statement carries zero weight.

So far this virus has behaved exactly like SARS COV 1, It also follows alot of the rules of spread as the rest of the corona virus spread, droplet spread. The individual viruses in the corona virus family have various target sites throughout the upper and lower resp. tract.

To date my colleagues in the healthcare system is not even registering a blip in ever increasing cases of "long covid". Which mean we don't have any data to support this claim.

[sMASH]

give it till next week to see how bad or how normal it is.

[BUG]

By some miracle our lack of discipline, inability to follow rules, lack of mask wearing, social distancing and weddings/mass gatherings have continued to produce low covid numbers and deaths.

Then now they claim somehow that indiscipline during Easter will doom us all and take up 1/4 of hospital beds (omg 1 whole quarter?)

You continue to choose to ignore what people here are saying in order to suit your agenda. People here are saying the complete opposite of what you've just asserted.

The T&T public, for the most part, have been disciplined and mainly followed (or have been forced to follow) covid protocols which when combined with mandatory face masks and partial lockdowns worked well and is the very reason why case numbers have stayed relatively low for 12 months.

I'll say it once more but I'm sure you will ignore it again; those conditions have changed in recent months as people have become fatigued with restrictions. The change in attitude over the last few months has been palpable. Even though attitudes and behaviours changed, we've been enjoying the benefits of all our hard work in keeping case numbers low over the previous 12 months. That's literally the reason why case numbers have risen slowly but steadily over the last 4 weeks, we can only enjoy the fruits of our labour for so long if we're going to continue to flaunt covid protocols.

This fatigue, combined with a major holiday period, are the perfect conditions for an explosion in case numbers.

Both France and Italy are covid-failure countries and their health care systems are again overwhelmed with covid cases and they have both been forced to enter almost full lockdowns (non essential shops closed etc) with curfews imposed for the Easter holiday period.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-56622471

I guess France and Italy are now part of your "End of Days Cult"? Lol.

*edited to remove AMP link