Gasolene super or Premium

[COFFEEBOY]

I USE Premium in my RD 1, However i need to know if Super Unleaded works well.
What are the both Octane Minimum requirements..

[JJ16]

^^^?

If you meant to ask, what is the octane levels of super and premium its 92 and 95 respectively.

If you are asking what gas is the minimum you may use on your crv, I would assume super since that has a B20...correct?

[Aaron 2NR]

super...hondas are tuned for 91rons....

[JJ16]

Good read for those in doubt

http://hondaswap.com/general-tech-maint ... 16a-59959/

and you'd notice some of them use 87 octane....

[ALLMOTOR]

can't believe ppl on a "tech" forum still talking soooooo much BS about octane requirements…. when you quote figures from an american forum…..they use "AKI" and not "RON" sooo when you see 87 or 89 octane with no units, they are using AKI which is somewhere equivalent to about 93 RON, so when you see guys using 91 in there hondas… they are really using atleast 95 "RON"…. OK Mr Aaron.. cool.

[X2]

^^ WHat ALLMOTOR said...


rd1 b20s are not too high in compression so it may be able to run on our super... pretty much every other B series engine (1.6, 1. will need to run on premium. Give it a try on your B20... if it knocks or pings, add an octane booster to every tank and it should be fine. ...cheaper than premium on every fill-up.

[JJ16]

Hmm well a more than handful d persons told me I could use super on my b16a, and I've been using it for almost a month now and no problems

[r3iXmann]

^^ WHat ALLMOTOR said...


rd1 b20s are not too high in compression so it may be able to run on our super... pretty much every other B series engine (1.6, 1. will need to run on premium. Give it a try on your B20... if it knocks or pings, add an octane booster to every tank and it should be fine. ...cheaper than premium on every fill-up.

several bottles, you mean

[X2]

Hmm well a more than handful d persons told me I could use super on my b16a, and I've been using it for almost a month now and no problems

Over time, the ecu will adapt as well as it can to the gas you are using. If you want to try this... reset your ecu with a full battery disconnect, etc... likely your car will want to vomit after... lol... but it also depends on the base timing set at the distributor on your particular car.

Reixman... if it takes more than 1 bottle to bring the octane up... it would be worth going back to premium. I still have to run a half bottle of booster with premium to avoid pinging in my b18.

[JJ16]

What you mean vomit? Cause I did that , twice.., currently my timing is set at 14degrees... 2 below stock timing. I asked a few persons like I said and they all used super , even those with b18c's

[r3iXmann]

Hmm well a more than handful d persons told me I could use super on my b16a, and I've been using it for almost a month now and no problems

Over time, the ecu will adapt as well as it can to the gas you are using. If you want to try this... reset your ecu with a full battery disconnect, etc... likely your car will want to vomit after... lol... but it also depends on the base timing set at the distributor on your particular car.

Reixman... if it takes more than 1 bottle to bring the octane up... it would be worth going back to premium. I still have to run a half bottle of booster with premium to avoid pinging in my b18.

octane booster points give .x RON..not 1,2 etc i.e if it adds '4 points', then that means you get 9x.4 RON therefore you'd need several bottles to see any real gain


and i've been using super in my R for the past few yrs, no problems

[X2]

Hmm well a more than handful d persons told me I could use super on my b16a, and I've been using it for almost a month now and no problems

Over time, the ecu will adapt as well as it can to the gas you are using. If you want to try this... reset your ecu with a full battery disconnect, etc... likely your car will want to vomit after... lol... but it also depends on the base timing set at the distributor on your particular car.

Reixman... if it takes more than 1 bottle to bring the octane up... it would be worth going back to premium. I still have to run a half bottle of booster with premium to avoid pinging in my b18.

octane booster points give .x RON..not 1,2 etc i.e if it adds '4 points', then that means you get 9x.4 RON therefore you'd need several bottles to see any real gain


and i've been using super in my R for the past few yrs, no problems

The 0.X points I wouldn't agree with across the board because it really depends on what octane booster brand you use as different brands use different chemicals to achieve the octane increase...also note that for marketing purposes... 0.1 can be considered 1 point. Even better boosters using AMMT or MTBE won't compare to the likes of Toluene or lead simulators or even race gas... which can actually give you increases of 5-15 points on RON !

But lets say you use a pricey booster like amsoil or nos...we need to understand the effect of RON, MON and PON (Pump Octane Number). If a octane booster gives you the effect closer to 2 points or less increase in RON.

RON + MON / 2 = PON (R+M/2 Method as posted in USA gas pumps).

Typically the MON figure is 75-85% of the RON figure. If RON of super is 92, then assuming best case scenario of 85%... 92RON x 85% = 78.2MON. So R+M/2 would be 92 + 78.2 = 170.2 / 2 = 85.1 Pump Octane. For reference...'Regular' in the USA is 87 octane.

You then throw in a bottle of booster, giving a 1, maybe 2 point increase at best (the BEST over the counter boosters would only give about 2 RON points). MON increase could look like this.. (2pt x 85%) 1.7 increase in MON... the math would look like this... 94 RON + 79.9 MON = 173.9 / 2 = 86.95

Also, the 'point' increase claim becomes less effective the higher the octane of fuel you are using it on... so if you cross your fingers and get a 2 point increase on super... you may only get 1.5 increase or less with premium as the base fuel.

JJ16... you are running 2 base timing degrees below stock.. that is a lot. Back when people were running ghetto management on turbo hondas, we would run 2-3 degrees retard on base timing. Bump up your base timing even 1 degree more on super and you will likely start to ping. Essentially you are shifting your power band way up the range... getting less fuel economy due to more unburnt fuel... if we had emissions regs in TnT, you'd have an issue passing with that setup. (but we don't, so no worry there).


gawd... this topic again eh... like 3 yrs in a row... lol

[JJ16]

Actually let me correct you by saying no I wouldn't ... I had my car on 16degrees while using super and no issues either. And like rexxi said, he uses super on his b18c as well with no issues. And I actually get approx 350-400km with a full tank of gas, so my car appears to be working normal...

Most people debate that premium is way better than super, where that may be the truth however ... In Trinidad we export the "good gas" and give people here the mess... I am almost positive premium isn't the octane it's advertised 2 be..

[JJ16]

Btw x2 I'm not saying what you said is wrong eh, I was just replying....

[X2]

Premium is definitely not much better than super. I can't even run premium on my b18c1 without a booster when using a stock ecu... it pings badly under load.


The honda ecu is a lot smarter than people give it credit for !

If you use 16 deg with super and the car detects knock, the ecu will automatically retard the timing (electronically), so you may not hear the knock at all. the knock sensor checks for knock from idle, so it can respond instantaneously. When the ecu realizes you haven't solved the problem with better gas quality, it starts modifying the short term fueling and ignition tables (stock ecu ONLY)... if you continue to use the crappy octane gas, it will affect the long term tables and the car will continually run at lower power. A good test is to take a pull against another stock b16 that runs premium and see how you do.

[jc]

X2 : what octane booster would you recommend?? there are so many of them out there.

i am thinking about trying the Booster from Molylube.

[JJ16]

Hmm thanks alot X2 never thought about that...

however at the moment, im not really running the car HARD per-say

Since i only recently bought the car, i've ran out 1st-3rd already and car pulls sweet.nothing like boost but its great for a N/A vehicle i think..

What i usually do when i buy a vehicle is first ensure everything is in GREATTTT condition before i start jamming it lol.

at the moment, im looking for a distributor or the internals of one since the previous owner had a oil leak in the seal and never replaced it, so the insulation on the wiring inside had a bit of oil soak.. prefer to change it than keep it and the wires strip a day and kiss up

[X2]

personally i use basic 0 to 60 prestone booster to get rid of light pinging... half a bottle to a tank works fine for me... at 30 bux a bottle, its a deal.

but the better boosters are NOs and Amsoil and others... but thats 100 bux or more a bottle... they will give better performance tho than cheaper boosters.... much like anything, it depends on what your goals are

[JJ16]

Hmm $30 is pretty cheap, and half bottle a tank is pretty good, thats like what... $30 per week on booster... i think i'd probably invest in that. and im sure if there is a way to get it wholesale and you buy like 12 bottles or so at a time you'd pay less than $30 a bottle...

Id look into that, and maybe invest in a few bottles and everytime i full up my tank, just throw a half bottle...it wont do much i guess but it definitely wont hurt either.

But at the moment, im still running my super